[Nova]

Well, the Emira FE at 94k plus destination is not a bargain, but I'm fine with that. The C8 is the undisputed bargain champion of the sports car world. I am also fine with that.

The Emira offers me a different driving experience than the C8 and it's a better match for what I'm looking for.

I do wish that there was a dealer near me, but I'm hoping that as Lotus gains sales momentum, one will open up.

 

[Nova]

Let's be realistic here, you're not buying a mass-produced car or even a low-production car from a company that's used to mass-producing vehicles. This isn't like buying a Toyota Supra/C8 where you have a huge company, dealer network, any part you need when you need it. A huge community, aftermarket support, and so on.

I think reality will hit for many people who may be price-sensitive buyers and are stretching to buy the car. You're NOT buying a BMW 2-series with an M-badge, you're buying a boutique brand/car. Expect imperfections as you would with a supercar purchase (i.e. low-volume one-off type issues). Your maintenance costs will be higher, parts costs will be higher, parts availability will be more scare, this may drive insurance costs up as well. There may not be a "known issue/recall" that you can just run to the dealer for. You may be debugging a problem with the dealer for the first time and so on.

Don't get me wrong, I don't expect the car to break down in the middle of the road and not work, but people should understand that, until proven otherwise, this isn't the kind of car you get as your daily driver and depend on for everything. At least I wouldn't. I've yet to own a single car/motorcycle that hasn't had a recall or a problem in the first year.

Lotus will be successful with the Emira, but as they attract more price conscious buyers, there will be higher stakes; anything minor will be amplified. Expectations differ between market segments, I hope both buyer and seller are ready for this.

I completely agree. In the next few months, a lot of people are going to "come to their senses" with regards to the Lotus and get weak at the knees. I had a car that died not once, but twice within 2000 miles of purchase. My reaction was "now I know it's a real Italian engine". If a person doesn't have that kind of attitude, they are going to be very frustrated with the ownership experience of a low-production car.

Like that car, the Lotus will also be my daily driver. But I'm not dependent on it. I have the family van to fall back to in case the Lotus needs servicing.

 

[Nova]

Here in Canada, our income are not 30% higher than those in the States but the price of the car is 30% higher while every other car brand price their cars in Canada 15-16% more than the US price. The tax on our income for an average salary are between 30% to 45%. Also my sales tax is 15% while in Florida it is 7% for example. The life cost is as much expensive here if not higher because of our hard winter ( high electric bill, winters tires, winter clothes and many more ) grocery cost is pretty much the same, our gas is more expensive, so at the end our purchasing power is hardly hit.

In USA the Emira will cost to the door including taxs and destination charge 103-105K while mine is going to cost 145K.

Gotta pay for your "free" social benefits like universal healthcare somehow.

 

[Nova]

The GBP-vs-USD exchange rate is near historical lows. This means it is prudent for Lotus to hedge against future increases with a 5-10 year horizon, given the anticipated length of time that the Emira will remain available in the US.

 

[Nova]

I do not buy that argument at all because car company can revise and change their price every year if they want and call that inflation so no need to fix a price to anticipate the 10 years to come.

That's not how marketing works. Consumers don't care about how your underlying costs change, they only care about the product, the price, and the sales/service network in support of the product. If you want to maintain a coherent marketing strategy towards your target buyers, then maintaining a fairly stable price is as important as the product itself. Lotus will not be able to charge 20% more for a car just because the exchange rate moved that much, because the market cannot absorb that large of a jump in price. The other cars that Lotus competes with will certainly not change their price in this manner. What you will also have are people waiting on the sidelines for the price to go down due to the exchange rate.

 

[Nova]

Oh, absolutely, I think it's clear that Lotus is capturing additional margins from the US at the current pricing level. Based on current demand, it seems Lotus won't have any difficulty finding buyers at least for the first couple of years. Once the car hit the market, there will be additional reviews, etc, and that'll keep demand going for a while.

The attractiveness privilege is strong with the Emira. A lot of people are going to like it just because of how it looks. A lot of quirks can be forgiven when the car looks so good.

 

[Nova]

I find that the Emira is no longer worth its price point, imo. At the price I'd rather go 911 GTS.

All roads along that logic lead to a C8 corvette.

 

[Nova]

400hp is great for a "poser". Sure the EMIRA is stunning......while PARKED.

This is just uncalled for. I don't truly believe any automotive enthusiast would think this about the Emira, given that it is a fairly quick car and exceptionally good at handling.

 

[Nova]

The below points is why the Lotus Emira has a pricing problem. Lotus nailed the looks.

• Add a few options your over 100k
• New Z06 will have a lower MSRP which is a Extreme performance sports car
• New Z51 C8 has a much lower MSRP & better performance
• Porsche GT4 will hold its value better with better dealer network & following
• Dealer Network (Not Good) matters many don’t want to sacrifice
• Power Matters to most buyers of sports cars
• Toyota Camry motor is a negative when attracting new audience. I loved mine in my Evora but I had to explain it to non Lotus enthusiast.
• I would have launched the Emira with the AMG motor tweaked to 425ish HP. This would have helped bringing in new buyers.

I love the looks of the Emira, I think Lotus shot their self in the foot when they said that the starting price will be in the 60’s.. I am still getting one with a manual transmission.

Your first point is flatly false. The FE, LOADED with options, is less than 100k. Where are you getting your numbers that just a few options will put the car over 100k?

Your other points have been hashed out repeatedly. The Emira isn't an extreme performance car, it is not a high-value car, it is not made by a car company with a large dealer network, it is not the most powerful car. There are plenty of choices along those lines if your needs lay somewhere else.

Look, the reason there are so many different car models on the market is that we all want something a little different. One car may be a poor fit for one person but a perfect fit for another. It is pointless and irrational to criticize a car for not being a perfect match with your particular needs and describe it as a "problem".

 

[Nova]

Hey. She is pretty, slow and pricey. It's an interesting combo to debate about with our hard earned cash.

Are you trolling too? I don't know anyone who would describe a car in the low 4 second range as "slow".

 

[Nova]

I am not knocking the EMIRA, but constructively critiquing some bad moves that hold it back from it making LOTUS tons of money.

I still really like the car, but like I am stating, BIG MISTAKE detuning the I-4 when its no secret what it can do (420hp-430hp) and then asking $75k for that with ZERO options.

If calling a car a "poser" is not knocking it, I don't know what is.

 

[Nova]

Come on... GM has a ton of smaller vehicles to average down their combined emissions numbers, allowing them to produce a car like the C8 that exceeds the allowed limit. Lotus has one car, they can't average down.

Again, the situation is far more complicated than any of us can appreciate. I am in the business of designing, manufacturing, and distributing consumer products. It's a mind-boggling mesh of regulatory compliance and licensing issues, and that's just for relatively simple products.

 

[Nova]

Plastidip!

 

[Nova]

I am torn here. I was very excited to get this car and put my deposit down. With the price north of $90k, I am very hesitant. I would love to see what an equally spec'd AMG I4 "First Edition" would cost.

Survey says 3-4k USD less. Probably $89,990

 

[Nova]

People think that the FE is priced higher because of options. Based on everything I've heard and read, the $94k is the base price. The FE is getting all of the options at no additional cost. So everyone hoping for a cheaper future Emira without options better be looking to get an i4. I don't think the V6 will be a penny less, in fact, it'll be more.

This makes no sense. I've heard it multiple times that the FE includes about 15K GBP of options discounted to about 12k. That's the benefit of buying an FE. I can't imagine any rational scenario where the old V6/Manual base price is almost 20k higher than the new i4 base.

 

[Nova]

You Joined 18 days ago & your already a Lotus expert that is very interesting, how many have you owned or driven. Owning a Lotus is a different experience than reading and typing out post. If you think the Emira which I am number 1 on the largest dealers list will come without quirks your going to be very surprise.

When I had my Evora it came with many sacrifices, build quality was not up to my standards with melting dashes, Velcro holding kick plates& instrument cover plate on. In the Texas heat the glue would loosen up on the Velcro’s which caused panels to fall off. the glue they used to put the chassis together made the car smell like a glue factory, had many conversations with the Lotus engineers and they finally change the glue. On some your needed a bionic leg to push in the clutch and on a hot day the clutch peddle would go to the floor (Fluid Tube needed a shield Oops ) the AC decided when it wanted to work. Many problems And I still stayed with the brand and feel the GT was a much better sorted out car even compared to the 400. I dismantled the entire Evora & fixed many of the issues in my post and added a extreme audio system. It was fun for me but, nothing like my Audi R8, Porsches, Corvettes Z06 C7 & C8 Z51 and many other exotics I rather not mention that I have owned & worked on.

Lotus has always had a marketing problem while Porsche is on the other side of that coin. We never know to much time left but the launch edition Emira could come out similar to my Alfa 4C LE, they checked the box on all the options, no major choices. This allowed production to control complexity and production.

My C8 Z51 was nice car but definitely felt big in comparison to the Lotus. I know the Z06 will be insane and I am looking forward to 9k RPM, DCT and a price under 100k, much better than the Porsche GT3 entry pricing..

I guess welcome aboard, Lotus is quirky but I enjoy fixing things and making them better this is why I appreciate Lotus. A few of my cars the Z06 will be number 63 Lotus Emira will be 64.
View attachment 1298999
View attachment 1299002 View attachment 1299001 View attachment 1299000 View attachment 1299003 View attachment 1299004

So instead of admitting that you were wrong in your statement, you launch into a personal attack and then proceed to ejaculate your car collection in an online d*ck waving session. What does it matter how many days I've been on this forum? I could be riding a tricycle right now and it wouldn't change the fact that you were flatly wrong. I never claimed to be an expert on Lotus cars. I don't need to be a Lotus expert to do basic math and tell that 93,900 is less than 100,000. In fact, you are proof positive that experience with Lotus cars has no correlation with proficiency in mathematics.

 

[Nova]

Never insulted you remember your the one who attacked my post. Not wrong Emira LE with destination & taxes unless you don’t pay taxes will be over 100k. Regardless you have a little edge about you, dealt with similar on the Corvette forms. The Good news we need people on this form that ride tricycles who claim they understand what they are talking about.

D_ _k waiving huh look in the mirror like you bragging about being a manufacturer and being in the know is no different than me saying I have experienced the ownership of Lotus and that was my point. You will see what I mean when you actually buy a Emira but it will take ownership to fully understand a Lotus not just typing dopey options on a forum!

I pointed out a factual error you made in your post. All you had to do was admit you were a little overly enthusiastic with your numbers, but instead, you start questioning my seniority on the forum and my overall experience with Lotus cars, as if that has anything to do with math. My experience with manufacturing was relayed within the context of the complexities of regulatory compliance, which is relevant. How does your experience with Lotus cars change the fact that 93,900 is less than 100,000? And now you are trying to weasel out of it by adding in taxes. Nobody adds in taxes when talking about car prices in the US because taxes are different for everyone depending on their state. How about also addressing the fact that the FE cars are loaded and comes with more than "a few" options?

You can't make a factually false post with an inflammatory tone, and then act indignant when you are challenged on the facts. If you don't like your posts being replied to in kind, then perhaps don't write posts using a tone that you wouldn't like to see direct at you.

 

[Nova]

I already addressed that in my original reply to your post. I'm not going to repeat myself for your benefit. Good evening.

 

[Nova]

The Engine sizes difference is significant.
View attachment 1299007

A lot of the M139 components are missing from the drawing, such as the intercooler, alternator, turbo, catalytic converter etc. It will still be a smaller package, just not as small as is shown in the drawing.