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Discussion Starter #1
Recently upgraded my brakes this winter. Changed front pistons, lines, pads and rotors.

Love them and it was a great improvement but as my driving sills have improved some, I feel I'm outgrowing them again, especially at 130 going into a hard brake zone. I feel like I am stomping a hole in the floor putting so much pressure on them. I have had other people drive my car and they say it feels fine, I just feel like I need more grab.

Pondering the thought of an upgrade to full floating rotors, 4 Pot calipers, and moving my original 2 pot front calipers to the rear. Can I use the full floating rotors on the rear also or only front?

I have 4 sets of LSS wheels for the track so want to stick with them. Will the LSS wheels fit? Will I need a spacer?

Does any one have any experience with the Lotus Sport AP racing 4 pot caliper upgrade? Likes/criticism/tips?

Can I use my LSS wheels with this mod?

Any insight on the rear brake mod adding the original calipers? How does this work for you and does the bias help on the track? Who did you source the adapter brackets from?

Any insight greatly appreciated. Thank you!
 

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I can't help you on the 4-pots but, you can certainly obtain floating rotors for both ends. As for mounting the front calipers on the rear; LSS wheels will not clear without a spacer. I use 3mm spacers with longer bolts. The calipers will clear Cup wheels without spacers. The rear brackets I use came from Sector 111. Try a quick search-there are a couple threads concerning front calipers to the rear.
 

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The only reason floating discs aren't readily used on the rear is because the discs are larger and can't install a hand brake. If you don't need the hand brake, you are go! If I recall correctly, the front caliper will overpower the rear brakes...you will need to bias it down somehow.
 

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I can just about guarantee that you don't need bigger brakes but more seat time.
 

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Discussion Starter #6
Good point JJ.
Padgid 4-2's Vulcan
Point taken Andy, truly the only weak point in my car at the moment is me. However I let a race driver take me around the track a few times driving my car and the biggest critism he had of my setup was the brakes.
 

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Maybe you have air bubbles in the lines?

I used Carbotech: Xp8 all around street (Elise) and they were great
I hear track setup is: XP10F/XP8R

My current brakes are the factory S240 larger package. They are a huge
improvement over the stock calipers/rotors. I cannot imagine why
anything beyond that would be necessary. The S240 fronts are stock pads
I think and the rear are XP8 I think.
 

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Discussion Starter #8
sleepe, they have been bleed and flushed for 6 months, doubtful.

Im happy with the Padgid grab so far, it was a great improvement over Ferrodo DS2500's.

What other combinations is everyone else that tracks their car using?
What does the cup car use? JJ.......????????
Anyone heard of bias adjustment with the front to rear mod?
 

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I've always considered the brakes as the strongest system on our cars. Very little we'll ever see on track days will be able to out brake us.

I'm running Sector Ultradiscs, some stainless lines, CL RC6 pads. Flush fluids maybe once a year.

Some of the best fun on track is having confidence in catching up a lot with many high hp cars at end of straights. Holding full throttle two seconds after many cars are on their brakes. Watching them twitch a bit when they can't believe you're back on them again.

I'm sure there is superior brake hardware out there, but I've had fun with the stuff I have. And I love to show people how small the rear calipers are. You just don't need big calipers on a light car
 

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Try Hawk DTC 30's. Next step up is DTC 60's. You may be surprised. Aren't those 4-2 Pagid's Blues. YUK you can cook those REAL easy and leave substrate all over your rotors which will be the source of any pulse (they don't warp). BTW I bleed before every track event so over course of a season its a multi time flush essentially. I was NEVER wanting for more brake in my car, and ask yourself, are you a pro? They always want more brakes! If you're readily able to lock'm up, more brake can't help extend the limits of tire traction.
 

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Discussion Starter #11
brg......yes blues. Thanks for the advice!
 

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Nobody asked the most important question... what tires are you running? I've been using R888 this year and Carbotech XP10/8 (front/rear) can easily break the traction limit of the tires.

Not to sound like an 8ss, but when guys like Phil are breaking records with the stock calipers why the itch to upgrade? :confused: You have all the stopping power you need with the right pads and tires.
 

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Discussion Starter #13
Okay Bob got the Carbone Lorraine brakes in today, we will see how I like them! I'm digging the price already, $150 less than Padgids. Will be at RA Aug 2nd.
 

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Just swapped the stock pads for CL RC6 on all 4 corners, and the difference in bite is amazing. Won't have them on track for a few weeks, but just bedding them in on the deserted back roads was an eye opener in terms of the difference. Even from cold.

I have the standard rear calipers with the AP Racing fronts, so I was not lacking for stopping power to begin with, but I am really looking forward to my next track day.

(Gunpilot, let me know your impressions if you hit the track before I do. I'll post mine if I am first.)
 

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I upgraded to AP 4 pots on my 2-11 and it was well worth the effort .
A definite confidence booster in the very late braking stakes .
On my new build (Elise SC race car ) have gone with ELiseparts UK 4 pot calipers with large pistons and AP 330 mm discs .
Elise Parts - Braking Systems - Brake Calipers - EP Tuning 4 Pot Calipers
I looked at going with floating discs , but the word I got from several with a lot of experience ... Was to keep away .
 

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Will these big time brake kits help other than in the hard brake zones at the end of long straights entering into tight turns?

Road Atlanta has one such place, entering 10A. VIR has two, turn one at end of front straight, and at the end of the back straight before Roller Coaster.

My point is in this discussion, how much real lap time benefit would one get, unless of course if genuine racing into these as passing zones?
 

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At my local track we have three hard braking zones from high speed and several other late braking opportunity corners .
Big brakes have given a lot more confidence coming down from speed and also the knowledge that hardly any other tin top can out brake you .. Nothing beats going up the inside with total confidence that you will not only out brake the competition but also make the corner ...
On actual lap times .. Hard to quantify as I was going through a learning phase at the time ( still am .. As we all are !! ) .. Actually it was the drive instructor who felt the car would benefit from larger brakes !! But at a guess I would say 1/2 a sec decrease .
Depends on the track
But as someone else pointed out .. Phil is setting lap records on OEM brakes ...
 

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I spent the big bucks for the 4 wheel Big Brakes kit. What a difference! The hotter they get the more they grab.
Good to hear as I am going 4 pot all round on my Elise .
 

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The Cup260 comes with 308-mm, full floating (drilled -eek-) discs. I didn't feel comfortable running the drilled discs, so I replaced them with these.
308mm Alcon Discs and Seriously Lotus Fully Floating Bells - Brake discs - Braking

If I were to go for bigger brakes, I'd go with 315mm like these...
Elise Parts - Braking Systems - Brake Discs - Floating Bell Brake Discs

The rears on the Cup260 are the same as all the rest of the cars.

Also, the Cup260 comes with Pagid RS14 pads...front and rear.
 
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