[wdonovan]

OK So I removed all camber shims las year and would up wioth both fronts only about -1.0 deg. Both rears abt -1.7 deg. Yh I could have got more neg front camber but didn't want to get involved with cutting the front spindles at the time (I am trying to schedule this soon tho). Am I thinking this wrong but why the hell do I really want do much rear neg camber? These cars weren'r even built with rear sway bars, which to me says all the camber change that Lotus wants to keep in check is in the front, not the rear. Why wouldn't I want to reshim the rear down to maybe -1.2 deg.

Next... and OK before you laugh I drive 4 different Lotuses and 2 very quick Ferraris (not street cars... F312P old IMSA cars) on Forza simulator. OK yh it's not a real life car but... every single one of these cars I set up with 0.4 to 0.5 toe in rear and 0.2 toe out front. Every car I pilot on this game drives around all competition as if they had run out of gas on every single turn. Turn in is like a slot car and I have no instability on exit accel. Is there any reason not to try some front toe out (I already have 1.2mm toe in rear... equiv to about 0.25 deg)? Thanks for listening to my ramblings.

 

[Turbopun]

Ah is this the info you want from the FSM? Just posted in your other thread. :up: Will see if I have soft copy, I know I have paper lying around somewhere.

 

[jds62f]

are you driving this car on track? autocross?

 

[holmz]

...These cars weren'r even built with rear sway bars, which to me says all the camber change that Lotus wants to keep in check is in the front, not the rear.
...

The swab bar has nothing to do camber.
Camber and roll stiffness are independently adjustable and have no cross coupling effects.

and yes....You may want some toe out on the front.

 

[pwildfire]

The only easy way to know for sure if your camber is correct or not is to take tire temps at the inside/middle/outside of the tire and compare. Assuming tire pressure is correct (linear temperature profile across the tire, as opposed to middle of the tire being hot or cold), then you can tell if camber is in the ballpark by the difference between inner and outer temps. Outer temp should be just a little hotter than inner, but not more than 5-10 degrees.

Since you seem to be into Forza, try tuning your setup and looking at the HUD data, you can see this effect there. The Forza alignment settings are not quite right for the Elise, but the method is the same. Once you understand how it works, you can find a track and do the same to your real car.

 

[holmz]

The only easy way to know for sure if your camber is correct or not is to take tire temps at the inside/middle/outside of the tire and compare. Assuming tire pressure is correct (linear temperature profile across the tire, as opposed to middle of the tire being hot or cold), then you can tell if camber is in the ballpark by the difference between inner and outer temps. Outer temp should be just a little hotter than inner, but not more than 5-10 degrees.

Since you seem to be into Forza, try tuning your setup and looking at the HUD data, you can see this effect there. The Forza alignment settings are not quite right for the Elise, but the method is the same. Once you understand how it works, you can find a track and do the same to your real car.

^that^ is a very well written post.

 

[fitfan]

except tires do not heat and cool evenly across. they are hot on the insides under braking and power, and outsides in cornering. so you do not get, nor want. and "even temp across the tire" the temp is moving all around the tire inside to out. the temp you get in the pits... represents the tires use coming into the pits.... but yea, if something is way off you will see a spike somewhere.

also, temps across the tire are not so much changed by tire pressure. that effects spring rate and deflection. which can only be used with proper set up, which determine how the tire is used by the chassis.

are we talking about a real car or a video game here?

 

[wdonovan]

Wow thx guys. A lot of good info. I drive a stock Elise w/ R tires on the track and I drive a lot on Forza (had it 2 months). Am trying to relate what I see in the game to real track. I know susp setting in Forza cannot be literally used on the car. Main thing I want to try in 3 weks is a little front toe out. The camber thing is interesting. I was looking at that wrong. And yh long time ago I was checking tire temps after jumping out in the cold pit and tires are actually even (tread is also being completely use). I go brain dead somewtimes and forget. thx all.