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Discussion Starter #1
I have not had a chance to drive the Elise yet (hopefully this week).
I did however get the chance last weekend to drive the Noble M12 GTO3R , I live only a couple miles from 1gRacing.

I was very impressed this car is a rocket and the country roads around Ross,OH are great for a test drive.
Definately the best handling car I have ever driven and probably the fastest.

OK now the bad stuff,
1 30K more than the Elise (about 77K complete)
2 I dont care for Turbos
3 They only build 200 a year (6 month wait)

If anyone else has driven both I would like your feedback.
 

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I saw a picture of one the other day, so started looking round for info. Amazing looking car =)

Hard to say which looks nicer, the Elise, or the Noble ..

The price tag and performance put it out of my league though.

I love turbos =)

And thats a shorter wait than I'm looking at for the Elise.

I've only driven the 111S Elise here. It was perfect for me. But then I'm not intending doing any races right now =)
 

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Paul, magazines say that the build quality on the Noble is top-notch. What was your impression?

I'm not sure Noble vs Elise is a fair comparison. From what I've read, the Noble is firmly in supercar territory -- in the company of the GT3 RS and Challenge Stradale, if not Enzo. That said, I would have expected you to have been even more impressed.
 

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Elise handsdown, better built, an actual dealer network albeit small. 3/36 k warranty, no hassling with specing the engine for it. etc. Significantly cheaper than the noble.


Chris
 

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Discussion Starter #5
The build quality was very good, the car I drove had about 15K on it and it was very solid.
The front and rear body panels are removable so I got a real good look at the frame and suspension, they also had one on the lift so I got a good look under the car as well.
I wanted to find something on the car to critique to make my desision easy but found nothing.

Very good build quality
World class chassis
Ford DOHC V-6
AP Racing brakes
2200 Lbs
 

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Wow, there's a 6 month waiting list on the 3R now? It was a 3-4 month wait back in June. They've been getting a lot of press lately though, so I guess it does make sense.

Did you get a chance to check out the M400 too?
 

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Not sure whether it is a fair comparison

Noble pitch themselves at 911 buyers. In Australia, almost 2x the price of a 111r I think.

Still chose the Elise though...unless you are talking of the new Noble 14 (see picture) or Noble 12 convertible
 

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Discussion Starter #8
gotapex said:
Wow, there's a 6 month waiting list on the 3R now? It was a 3-4 month wait back in June. They've been getting a lot of press lately though, so I guess it does make sense.

Did you get a chance to check out the M400 too?
No, I only drove the M12, hope to see the M400 when one comes in.
 

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zvezdah1 said:
Elise handsdown, better built, an actual dealer network albeit small. 3/36 k warranty, no hassling with specing the engine for it. etc. Significantly cheaper than the noble.


Chris
Have you actually seen/driven a Noble? They are awesome cars. Pictures don't do it any justice (trust me). Performance wise the Noble beats the Elise hands down. The handling is perfect the acceleration is incredible.

The down side is the service and warranty (1 year). It is of course much more expensive and will be even more quirky than the Liz as they make so few per year. They have known issues with speedometer giving out after heavy rain. Mainly small niggles but it's to be expected with such a limited production.

The fit and finish of the Noble is excellent. The paint finish is as good as on any $100k car. The seats are horrible; however they will customize them for you.

Looks wise I prefer the Elise. The Liz looks like a modern day Ferrari Dino. Don't get me wrong I do like the look of the Noble, but I love the look of the Elise.

It's a hard choice they are both fabulous cars. In the end you must decide what fits you better. The Elise feels more special to me than the Noble. It requires more of it's driver... It's fussy and impractical. You must climb into it instead of just getting in. Call me crazy, but for me all these things just add to the whole experience. While this is all true it also manages to be more practical than the Noble by the fact that it has a boot. Funny, never thought I’d ever get to call the Liz "more practical".
 

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Discussion Starter #10
With 1gRacing only a couple miles from my house it makes the parts/service thing a little more comforting, my Lotus dealer is about a 2hr drive not to bad either.
 

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The M400 comes in about $10k more than the GTO-3R, and it seems you get a lot for that difference. There's a reasonably sizable jump in power, better suspension (shocks, front sway bar), better tires, the track day sump is included, better Racing Sparco seats, closer together seats, better shifter, and a bunch of other things. If you're going to go with a Noble, the M400 upgrade is pretty convincing for the money over the GTO-3R, it seems.
 

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Discussion Starter #12
gotapex said:
The M400 comes in about $10k more than the GTO-3R, and it seems you get a lot for that difference. There's a reasonably sizable jump in power, better suspension (shocks, front sway bar), better tires, the track day sump is included, better Racing Sparco seats, closer together seats, better shifter, and a bunch of other things. If you're going to go with a Noble, the M400 upgrade is pretty convincing for the money over the GTO-3R, it seems.
Do they share the twin turbo Ford V6?
 

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I think if you favor acceleration, speed, and power more, the Noble is the choice. For direct, fun handling, the Elise. But I'm not saying they are diametric opposites, rather, they are similar in nature with "spicing" that leans one way or the other. The Noble has superb, well-developed handling, and the Elise has excellent performance.

If the extra $$$ is no object, and given your proximity to 3G, it seems like just decide if speed or tossable handling is more to your taste. I favor the Elise myself, but not just because speed is not as important, but also for the subjective reason of always wanting to own a Lotus, whatever that means. But I personally would love to own a Noble M12 as well.



DLY
 

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I have not heard any good things about the Noble interior :(
 

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etypeiii said:
I think if you favor acceleration, speed, and power more, the Noble is the choice. For direct, fun handling, the Elise. But I'm not saying they are diametric opposites, rather, they are similar in nature with "spicing" that leans one way or the other. The Noble has superb, well-developed handling, and the Elise has excellent performance.

If the extra $$$ is no object, and given your proximity to 3G, it seems like just decide if speed or tossable handling is more to your taste. I favor the Elise myself, but not just because speed is not as important, but also for the subjective reason of always wanting to own a Lotus, whatever that means. But I personally would love to own a Noble M12 as well.



DLY
The Noble is just as tossable as the Elise and can out handle the Elise on both road and track. To understand the Noble think of what the Elise would be like with an extra 150 bhp. Price and reliability would seem to be the main concerns. Running cost will also likely be much more costly for the Noble.
 

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paulf1 said:
Do they share the twin turbo Ford V6?
Yeah, they share the Duratec block. However, the M400 has forged pistons (this, I believe may have trickled down to the GTO-3R by now), higher lift cams, ceramic ball bearing Garrett T28's (instead of T25's), and a remapped fuel delivery.
 

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Patricko said:
I have not heard any good things about the Noble interior :(
The reviews I've read said the interior is finished in Alcantara and is quite nice, certainly upscale from the Elise.

The biggest criticism in the several reviews I read are about the windows not rolling all the way down (like you'd expect with a kit car) and an extremely wide turning radius.

Also, I talked to a dealer who sold one on eBay recently and he swears it takes at least 8 months to get one built and assembled and that the final cost will be more like $86,000, once you put in A/C (a $3,000 option!), pay for engine installation kit and labor, etc.
 

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zvezdah1 said:
Elise handsdown, better built, an actual dealer network albeit small. 3/36 k warranty, no hassling with specing the engine for it. etc. Significantly cheaper than the noble.


Chris
I wouldn't bet on the Elise being better built (not that it is worse either). The Noble is built by Hi-Tech Automotive in South Africa. They have a very modern 270,000 square foot assembly plant with over 600 employees. I haven't viewed the Noble for fit & finish, but I have looked closely at the Superformance cars built there and they were absolutely top-notch.
 

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235home said:
The biggest criticism in the several reviews I read are about the windows not rolling all the way down (like you'd expect with a kit car) and an extremely wide turning radius.
Oh yeah, another change on the M400. The steering was changed so that lock to lock is now 2.5 turns instead of 1.8 turns, with the same ratio. The turning radius is much improved as a result.
 

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Derek said:
The Noble is just as tossable as the Elise and can out handle the Elise on both road and track. To understand the Noble think of what the Elise would be like with an extra 150 bhp. Price and reliability would seem to be the main concerns. Running cost will also likely be much more costly for the Noble.

I have driven neither car, so anything I write is pure speculation or inference. Reading the reviews that I have on the M12, its handling is not described in quite the way the Elise's handling is. I have no doubt that the M12 could post better numbers in terms of lap times, G-forces, apex speeds. But does it match the Elise in the qualities of tossability, predictability, directness? My impression is that it is in a similar vein, but not quite.

The closest "evidence" I have is the quote from the June 2004 Car and Driver by Ray Hutton, saying "Although the M12 feels light and nimble, almost like a Lotus Elise, it also feels solid."

My impression is the Noble is to the Elise, what the Elise is to the Caterham Super 7. As well developed as the M12 is, I don't think it is a magic bullet that is everything the Elise is in physical terms, plus more. At least for me. And continuing in that direction, I don't think the Elise is what the Caterham is, but the Elise is where I've chosen to "stop." Someone who wants supercar speed might well prefer to "stop" with the M12. I've said before that if someone really wants a 350 HP Elise, they may be better off getting a Noble.

But I always fear that if I write something like this, people take it as disparaging Car x. I'm not. Some people might prefer the qualities of Car x, or they might be too closely matched in their view to make a difference.

I can only say, I have no doubt a Carrera GT or a Enzo will "outhandle" the Elise, but I think the Elise has handling qualities and feel neither of those two match.



DLY
 
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