[roblotus79]

Lotus Esprit MARK1 Series 1 Esprit | eBay

 

[carbuff]

Birmingham, Michigan. Anybody know the car?

Sad to see this, I'm sure the boys on the S1S2S3 Yahoo group will find out before I get home...

:sad:

 

[shay2nak]

bummer. Looks like it has a lot of potential though, no?

 

[shill68]

Sad, but the owner wastes no time in doing something.

 

[escondidoron]

bummer. Looks like it has a lot of potential though, no?

Concur. That is a repairable car if someone is motivated.

I feel for the owner. This is what real fire damage to an S1 looks like:

 

[shill68]

The one on ebay looked pretty fixable, and for $650 was a hell of a deal.

 

[Tony K]

The one on ebay looked pretty fixable, and for $650 was a hell of a deal.

Wow, he gave that thing away. I think the auction started with a reserve and that the description said a $2k down payment was required immediately upon winning the auction. That put off a couple of people I know who would have otherwise bid on it (and would have paid more). I guess at some point he removed those conditions?

 

[sleekgt]

The one on ebay looked pretty fixable, and for $650 was a hell of a deal.

It likely didn't sell for $650 - the auction was set for 7 days and he ended at 2 days (a bug in eBay). Most likely it was either a Buy It Now or he sold it locally and ended the auction (although it should have not listed the highest bid).

I've noticed when I sell stuff on eBay, they've had some bugs when trying to end an auction early.

 

[shill68]

It likely didn't sell for $650 - the auction was set for 7 days and he ended at 2 days (a bug in eBay). Most likely it was either a Buy It Now or he sold it locally and ended the auction (although it should have not listed the highest bid).

I've noticed when I sell stuff on eBay, they've had some bugs when trying to end an auction early.

That makes more sense.

 

[carbuff]

Well, thanks to SLEEKGT, a member of the S1S2S3 Yahoo list bought that car and has taken delivery. :up:

This dude now has TWO black Esprits.

 

[wachuko]

Well, thanks to SLEEKGT, a member of the S1S2S3 Yahoo list bought that car and has taken delivery. :up:

This dude now has TWO black Esprits.

Bill bought it, correct. I went over his place to take a look. He already started working on it. Plan is to get it running again. Here are a few photos.

He took off the body to make it easier to work on the engine and wire harness and inspect/repair.

 

[wachuko]

It likely didn't sell for $650 - the auction was set for 7 days and he ended at 2 days (a bug in eBay). Most likely it was either a Buy It Now or he sold it locally and ended the auction (although it should have not listed the highest bid).

I've noticed when I sell stuff on eBay, they've had some bugs when trying to end an auction early.

It did... owner wanted to make sure it went to someone that would bring it back to life instead of breaking it out for parts. If I remember my conversation with Bill correctly...it was closer to 1,300.00 by the time he got it back home... between gas, trailer rental, etc...

I hope that I can buy it off Bill once it is back on the road. I am really looking forward to owning one.

 

[roblotus79]

Wow! That's great. There are too few S1's left in the world to have another one go for parts. Wish I had the resources and skills to have taken it on.

 

[maxvelocity]

It did... owner wanted to make sure it went to someone that would bring it back to life instead of breaking it out for parts.

These situations with project cars are more common than one would think. I have seen sellers take lower offers than those of others, cancel auctions, and redirect the sale towards the ones that they feel have the best chance of getting the car back on the road.

One can tell a lot of the suspected capabilities and intentions of a person when talking in person or via phone call rather than text or email.

 

[shill68]

That's great! Kudos to the PO for doing the right thing by the car, I'm always sad when I see cars parted out unnecessarily.

 

[Tony K]

These situations with project cars are more common than one would think. I have seen sellers take lower offers than those of others, cancel auctions, and redirect the sale towards the ones that they feel have the best chance of getting the car back on the road.

One can tell a lot of the suspected capabilities and intentions of a person when talking in person or via phone call rather than text or email.

Some of the truest words ever spoken!

I've been on both the seller and buyer side of this numerous times . . . and will only deal on the phone or in person . . .

 

[jtrealty]

I think it is great that someone will "step up" and get it going again but the market does not reward for that. Once something like a fire, accident, or flood is in a car's history you are lucky to get 1/2 of what a similar car with a clean history and Title can fetch. I saved a '99 and am having trouble selling it even with a low price and taking a BIG loss. Saving a Lotus is no small undertaking. Getting all of the parts is difficult and expensive since they are rare and Lotus no longer supports the older cars. Hopefully in this case the damage may be limited to fiberglass and easily replaceable or repairable parts. Worst case the car gets parted out so others can be saved.
David Teitelbaum

 

[Tony K]

I think it is great that someone will "step up" and get it going again but the market does not reward for that. Once something like a fire, accident, or flood is in a car's history you are lucky to get 1/2 of what a similar car with a clean history and Title can fetch. I saved a '99 and am having trouble selling it even with a low price and taking a BIG loss. Saving a Lotus is no small undertaking. Getting all of the parts is difficult and expensive since they are rare and Lotus no longer supports the older cars. Hopefully in this case the damage may be limited to fiberglass and easily replaceable or repairable parts. Worst case the car gets parted out so others can be saved.
David Teitelbaum

I think there is a big difference between a modern car and a 37 year old car, as well as between an old Lotus vs. most other cars.

You'd be amazed at how many S1s and S2s have had engine fires and have been repaired (think plastic fuel tees and loose banjo fittings). This black car is no worse than a lot of them. The great thing about an old (1960s-70s) Lotus is that they are simple, body sections are available, and as they are fiberglass they can be repaired to as-new condition; it's not like a metal-bodied unibody car where "it will never be the same." And with something as rare and fast-appreciating as an S1, many people who want one today will take what they can get.

These cars, around the world, are being subject to complete nut-and-bolt restorations, the work of which is far more extensive than what 290H requires. There's no reason 290H (this black S1) can't emerge without a trace.

No matter how badly an old Lotus is damaged, with the thoroughness, the back-to-newness, that can be performed in repairing an old Lotus, there's no reason for an intelligent, knowledgeable buyer to shy away from a car with a well-documented, properly executed restoration.

Cheers,

Tony K.

 

[maxvelocity]

I think it is great that someone will "step up" and get it going again but the market does not reward for that. Once something like a fire, accident, or flood is in a car's history you are lucky to get 1/2 of what a similar car with a clean history and Title can fetch. I saved a '99 and am having trouble selling it even with a low price and taking a BIG loss. Saving a Lotus is no small undertaking. Getting all of the parts is difficult and expensive since they are rare and Lotus no longer supports the older cars. Hopefully in this case the damage may be limited to fiberglass and easily replaceable or repairable parts. Worst case the car gets parted out so others can be saved.
David Teitelbaum

David,
There is a big difference between your 99 Esprit with a tainted title and this car.

The largest difference is the build date of this car which is 1977. Cars built in this time era 1954-1981 have non uniform VIN numbers before the NHTSA standardized 17 character VIN number put into effect for cars built after 1981 and later the world standard ISO 3779. Therefore it is my understanding that most likely this car and others built during the stated time era will have no history before or after any incident as reported by the Carfax and other car history reporting companies.

It is possible for a car with a non standard VIN to have a salvage title but once it is reissued a clean title after a rebuild, it will be very difficult to determine a past salvage title depending if it was issued a rebranded or clean title. I know of several states that the title says nothing to indicate rebuilt or salvage after inspection and title reissue. Many depend on carfax and the like for history info. But this car will fall into the history not available category.

It will simply state:
Possible Explanations why the report is not available include:
The seller didn't enter the vehicle identification number correctly.
The vehicle is too new to have a history report.
The vehicle was manufactured prior to 1981.
The vehicle didn't have a 17-digit vehicle identification number.
The vehicle wasn't intended for the US market (such as limited production exotics).

 

[Tony K]

David,
There is a big difference between your 99 Esprit with a tainted title and this car.

The largest difference is the build date of this car which is 1977. Cars built in this time era 1954-1981 have non uniform VIN numbers before the NHTSA standardized 17 character VIN number put into effect for cars built after 1981 and later the world standard ISO 3779. Therefore it is my understanding that most likely this car and others built during the stated time era will have no history before or after any incident as reported by the Carfax and other car history reporting companies.

It is possible for a car with a non standard VIN to have a salvage title but once it is reissued a clean title after a rebuild, it will be very difficult to determine a past salvage title depending if it was issued a rebranded or clean title. I know of several states that the title says nothing to indicate rebuilt or salvage after inspection and title reissue. Many depend on carfax and the like for history info. But this car will fall into the history not available category.

It will simply state:
Possible Explanations why the report is not available include:
The seller didn't enter the vehicle identification number correctly.
The vehicle is too new to have a history report.
The vehicle was manufactured prior to 1981.
The vehicle didn't have a 17-digit vehicle identification number.
The vehicle wasn't intended for the US market (such as limited production exotics).

I was originally going to include something about this in my post above, but thought it might not even be an issue - as the transaction was private seller to buyer, I presume the title is still clear?

But yes, with their 9-digit VINs, early Esprits are easy to obtain a clean, unbranded title for (not to mention many go overseas). And if a reconstruction is done well and thoroughly documented, why not?