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Discussion Starter #1
An instructor once told me heal-and-toe separates the good drivers from the really good drivers- I can appreciate that advice more and more with each DE, and improving track times-

Basically, I'm bangin the $hit out of third after a long straight (100+ for Barber), and a hard break- Not only is it rough on the car, it's not unusual for the rear tires to lock up just before turn-in-

I've been working on my heal-and-toe technique, and I'm getting frustrated trying to work with my size 13's and Lotus racing pedals- BTW, I installed a Razer pedal to aid with this-

I need someone else with huge feet to give me some reassurance, and maybe some pointers to keep me on task-

Thanks for any input!
 

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While some will have definite opinions, I believe that HT technique is a personal thing varies from driver to driver. There are several approaches, and the RIGHT one is the one that works for you. In fact, technique can vary from car to car with the same driver. My point, sample various approaches rather than just trying one that may work for someone else. At your next DE, survey other drivers and instructors for their approaches.

That being said, in the Lotus, my HT is actually a ARCH/BALL. That is I modulate the brake with the upper edge of the ball of my foot and blip with the bottom of the arch. When doing this my foot is rotated almost horizontal. I know others that use the inside of the ball and blip with the outside of the heel with their foot in more of a vertical position.

I do think with your large feet the Razer is probably not needed, but then again, see my lead-off statement in this post.

Good luck, and have fun!
 

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I've got fairly wide size 12 feet, and I can't see how you could consistently heel and toe the stock pedals with anything larger. Even with the narrowest shoes I can find, it's tight. I use the vertical left side brake, right side rolling on the gas technique because that's how I was taught. The true h&t means toe/ ball on the brake and blipping the throttle with the heel. I guess the best technique is the one that gets you through the corner the fastest without an unintended field trip.
 

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while you are learning how to drive, just concentrate on driving, not how your big feet are making a difficult task even more difficult. I am not saying to be mean, just realistic. I suggest one of the below.

1) as the car slows down, clutch in, shift into the new gear, let the clutch out slowly so you dont jolt the rear tires, turn in when ready. No this isnt going to wear out your clutch. The clutch regularly slips in first gear to accelerate a 2000 lb car. It isnt going to kill it to accelerate 75 lbs worth of rotating mass. If you let the clutch out gently, you will be just fine. I regularly switch from 5th to 2nd on the track and depending on how frantic my braking is, sometimes I use #1 and sometimes #2.

2) as the car slows down, clutch in, shift into the new gear, finish your braking, turn in, blip the throttle with your whole foot, let the clutch out quickly and keep driving. Ideally, there should be a moment of time between when you release the brakes and start to need gas. That time can be spent blipping the throttle. I did this for 9 years in my race car. Never screwed it up once, clutch looked like new. If you immediately need gas after braking, you slowed down too much (unless, of course, you are trail braking, which you shouldnt be doing as a student in a mid engine car).

Hope that helps.
 

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I need someone else with huge feet to give me some reassurance, and maybe some pointers to keep me on task
I have size 14 feet and can heel and toe in my 06 Elise with no drama. Are you trying to rotate your foot or are you just moving your foot while still vertical? Also do you use driving shoes?

My technique is to brake with the ball of my foot and tap the throttle with the right side of my sole. I do not rotate my foot at all since it is easily wide enough to hit the accelerator and brake while vertical. I use Oakley driving shoes and drive an 06 so the pedal height is not an issue.
 

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No problem with my size 15's now that I have the relative height of the accelerator and brake pedals correct. If you're interested in lowering both pedals, you can search for my pedal postings. With my new accelerator pedal, I don't have to rotate my right foot to avoid having my toes hit the accelerator cable/return spring.

My suggestion on driving style: practice doing it slowly on the street away from traffic. Take your time. Pretend that the shift knob is a raw egg and be gentle. No reason to rush the movements.

Thanks,

Joe
 

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I've got fairly wide size 12 feet, and I can't see how you could consistently heel and toe the stock pedals with anything larger. Even with the narrowest shoes I can find, it's tight. I use the vertical left side brake, right side rolling on the gas technique because that's how I was taught. The true h&t means toe/ ball on the brake and blipping the throttle with the heel. I guess the best technique is the one that gets you through the corner the fastest without an unintended field trip.
+1
 

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I only have a 10 10.5 size foot. And I agree that the technique will change with car. For my Audi, I'm able to rotate my foot ccw and use the ball of my foot on the brake and edge of my heel on my gas. In the Elise, I couldn't do this b/c there wasn't enough room to rotate the foot, also in my 05, the pedal heights were killing me (just fixed today). In the Elise, my foot stays more vertical and I keep the left side of my entire foot on the brake then roll it over on a vertical axis so the entire right side of my foot hits the gas.
Remember, depending on what technique you use, you can also change the horizontal spacing between the pedals which may help.
 

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Discussion Starter #9
Thanks for all of the feedback! This is exactly the encouragement I needed! If Chococar can do it, anybody can (SIZE 15's :crazyeyes)!

By the way, true H & T would be about impossible for me, as I am straddling the column- So, I have been practicing the "break with left side of my foot / plip with the right side" technique (not on the track), and so far I'm a blundering idiot-

I've tried racing shoes, and Oakley low-tops seem to accomodate me better than any other, but I've always tracked in aqua socks, and it's hard to beat the way they feel as long as I can get away with it-

Thanks again for the advice!
 

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I've got fairly wide size 12 feet, and I can't see how you could consistently heel and toe the stock pedals with anything larger. Even with the narrowest shoes I can find, it's tight. I use the vertical left side brake, right side rolling on the gas technique because that's how I was taught. The true h&t means toe/ ball on the brake and blipping the throttle with the heel. I guess the best technique is the one that gets you through the corner the fastest without an unintended field trip.
People may talk about "true" -- but it's really what works. I learned rolling my foot onto the throttle, and as I got older I worried in real race cars I wasn't doing it right...until a guy who won the 24 hours of Daytona three times told me that he did the exact same thing.

I think the "rolling foot" (i.e., using the right edge to blip) only works for people with bigger feet, though. I'm a size 13.

Steve
 

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If it is true what they say about big feet... then there may be another option.
Then leave your left foot on the clutch, the right foot on the gas.

Get creative for the brake.
(You might need to move the seat forward a bit if it doesn't reach).
 

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Try different shoes. I have size 13 feet and started with Puma Speedcats which are very narrow. Like others mentioned, in order to H&T, I had to rotate my heel to hit the throttle which was an impossibility given foot size and ankle problems. After switching to Piloti's which are somewhat wider, straddling the brake and throttle became possible.
 

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Try different shoes. I have size 13 feet and started with Puma Speedcats which are very narrow. Like others mentioned, in order to H&T, I had to rotate my heel to hit the throttle which was an impossibility given foot size and ankle problems. After switching to Piloti's which are somewhat wider, straddling the brake and throttle became possible.
You can always move the brake pedal a little closer to the accelerator too...
 

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Although I need to learn to HT with 13" narrow feet, my primary issue is the length of my LEGS. Since the top of my knees are right about in line with the center of the steering column, or just touching the column stalks, the angle between my lower leg and foot is less than 90 degrees, probably more like 70. Try reducing that angle and then rotate your foot - not easy, and lots of stress on the ankle. I think this will have more of an impact on how I am able to HT.
 

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Although I need to learn to HT with 13" narrow feet, my primary issue is the length of my LEGS. Since the top of my knees are right about in line with the center of the steering column, or just touching the column stalks, the angle between my lower leg and foot is less than 90 degrees, probably more like 70. Try reducing that angle and then rotate your foot - not easy, and lots of stress on the ankle. I think this will have more of an impact on how I am able to HT.
That is a good part of the reason I had to use the side of my foot. I couldn't rotate my foot for jack straddling the steering column. The other issue I had (in a number of cars, not just the Elise) and I'm sure others have had is that often my toes hit structures under the dash, above the pedals.
 

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LBC111,

You could always move the pedals forward as I did (documented in this posting a couple of years back):
http://www.lotustalk.com/forums/f25/3-more-legroom-tall-persons-pedal-mods-19669/

Take a drive up to Santa Barbara and check it out, if you want.

Thanks,

Joe
Damn! Thanks for that! I may just take a drive up there sometime... I get up to Sta Barbara occasionally for work, and would love to take a look/sit in your car. However, I'm not quite that mechanically inclined, and don't have appropriate tools, so maybe I can pay someone to do it for me!

-dan
 
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