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Looking at how the car is loaded, you were clearly hard on the brakes through the whole corner and didn’t correct until your right wheel was already off the track and even then the correction looks minor (you can see sunlight on maybe half the front right tire) and the car was already in rotation to seal you fate.

You may not remember but do you recall where you were looking? My guess is you my have been looking towards the wall you didn't’ want to hit. Always “only look where you want to go“ and “look away from danger”.
 

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IMO, your "problem" is really on your set up for the right hander.

As you reach the end of the back straight and enter the brake zone you should be moving across to track left through the brake zone. You stayed on the right edge til very late and effectively pinched the the turn. Your car never got stable.

Through the brake zone, the camera car is always to the track left of you, despite trailing by a good 8 to 10 lengths. Which is where you want to be.

Freeze on 0:03. Your car has a lot of roll because you've got so much wheel into her. Right up to just before 0:07. Ideally, you should be braking hard and the car should be flat. Then you hit the turn in late with a lot of wheel, and she rolls the other way. The car never gets stable. And you're still braking. Your spin starts at 0:08.


VIR is no joke. The first weekend I ever ran it was in Grand configuration. I nearly swore the track off. Couldn't get my bearings much less develop any driving technique.

IMO, the challenging spots for a Lotus are Turn 4, Turn 10 and Hog Pen.

I can draw the line I think you took versus where I would want you to be if that helps. Sometimes it's hard to explain these things without handsignals and word emphasis.
 

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Heh Turn 4 was my nemesis for the longest time but I love Turn 10 and Hog pen.
I've seen some horrific **** go down on T10. Including an Exige hooking it and coming to a rest upside down on the outside tire wall.

It's a fun turn, right up to the moment it isn't. I think it's easy to carry too much speed there after a heroic run through the climbing essess.

I went off in Hog Pen at low speed on a damp track. Outside. It's steep. And you can end up in the trees. I never could carry big speed through there like the front engine cars could. Which then compounds onto the front straight. No issues with making up some of it in the T1 braking zone though.
:devilish:
 

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Discussion Starter · #45 · (Edited)
So much was learned with the VIR event.
I had not had the car on the track in two years and had done suspension work to correct the wandering feeling at high speed and the feel while cornering. So not only was I rusty as hell I had a whole new feeling car. Gone was the wandering on straights and the light front end feeling and the car felt much more controllable in the turns.
There is no substitute for seat time and it really showed for me. I want to thank all of you for your help in helping me analyze what was happening with that rubber being laid down by that LR tire.
Looking forward to getting up there again in the fall. Was supposed to have been heading home today from Tail of the Dragon but cancelled my hotel reservations last week when I found some rubbing on 180 deg of the inner wheel lip and didn't want to chance any issues while at ToD. Rim was contacting my Ohlins but only when backing up and turning left. A little bummed but rather be safe than sorry. In fact I came in early 3-4 times at VIR to check out new sounds that were abnormal. First was inner liner popped on one corner, second was a loud pop with metallic ring sound and I later found one belly pan bolt had snapped, third was loud crash and then rattling from passenger door later to be found the top guide rail screw backed out letting everything rattle, and last was front grill had popped loose when I spun on 14 and was missed by track steward and let back on track and car didn't feel right and grill was making sounds so I called it a day. The not feeling right was probably the 1/2" of clag that built up when going offline.
Tomorrow's another day!
 
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I've seen some horrific **** go down on T10. Including an Exige hooking it and coming to a rest upside down on the outside tire wall.

It's a fun turn, right up to the moment it isn't. I think it's easy to carry too much speed there after a heroic run through the climbing essess.

I went off in Hog Pen at low speed on a damp track. Outside. It's steep. And you can end up in the trees. I never could carry big speed through there like the front engine cars could. Which then compounds onto the front straight. No issues with making up some of it in the T1 braking zone though.
:devilish:
Yeah I've had a Porsche spin out in front of me on 10 but luckily saw the whole thing through and they were able to keep it on the inside of the track.

Hog Pen in the rain/wet/damp is no joke. I spent memorial day weekend at VIR and had plenty of wet laps around there and if you aren't prepared for it the track will have its way with ya.
 

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Random thoughts:
I agree with the main culprits ID’d, above:
too fast, a sudden lift at a critical moment/place, a hair off line.
Add, a mid-engine car that can easily spin.

I say the first lesson you have to learn to do track days is humility:). There is always someone in a clapped out Civic who is faster. Checking one’s ego at the gate is critical. By publically asking for assistance, you have demonstrated mastery of this lesson.

Another Important lesson is learning your limits as well as the car’s.You really only do that when you have exceeded them, as you did here.

Lesson three: anything can happen on the track, as both you, but especially the trailing BMW, learned.

Tons of positives here. You didn’t hit anything! Very impressive. Both you and the car are intact, as are the other drivers, their cars and the Armco. And you have turned it into a teaching moment, for all of us.

VIR is one of my favorite tracks, but it is very intimidating. Once upon a time I went off there in my new Evo, in the uphill S’s. At 112 mph. I swore off track days and traded my Evo in for a Prius! Several years later I was back on track in a BMW M3, followed by a series of other interesting cars, but it was a long recovery!

I
 

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When I see a car spin off and then come back on, that is usually because the driver let up on the brake for some reason. Once you've committed the spin with the brake, stay in the brake until stopped. I have seen plenty of let-offs at ~15 mph that resulted in the car coming back on track and that can end very badly.
 
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