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Happy To Be Here
2013 Lotus Evora IPS - Carbon Gray
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Don’t be fooled. It’s probably just another Fiero with a body kit...
 

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Kudos to Chevrolet for entering the 21st century! Love'm or hate'm, you have to respect them now. I've said for years, prior to the C5, they were a joke. From the C5 Z06 forward, they have become an ever more credible track car. I will drive one someday....
 
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Chevrolet is going into the 21st century backwards then, as they refuse to provide a proper transmission for a sports car. If it's not a manual you might as well be driving a Tesla, in my not-so-humble opinion on the matter.
Ferrari and Lambo both stopped selling manual transmissions. Let's face it, modern day automatics are faster than you or I will ever be at shifting. But I agree, the manual is more of a driver experience.
 

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Acme Super Moderator ** The Enforcer **
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Chevrolet is going into the 21st century backwards then, as they refuse to provide a proper transmission for a sports car. If it's not a manual you might as well be driving a Tesla, in my not-so-humble opinion on the matter.
That's a Rip Van Winkle type of statement. I like manual transmissions, but even modern motorcycles use a clutch mostly for first gear stop-and-go situations, as a blipper is faster.

Ferrari and Lambo both stopped selling manual transmissions. Let's face it, modern day automatics are faster than you or I will ever be at shifting. But I agree, the manual is more of a driver experience.
You've obviously been awake for the last two decades. The trend away from manual transmissions will only continue to increase. Faster has always been something I want, and then I want more.

San
 

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In a race, gotta have the modern speed and faultlessness of an automatic , or even better a sequential.

For enjoying my life, a manual is ever entertaining. It’s all about driver involvement or you ought to be on another forum.
 
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If Evora had a PDK quality unit, or at least the faultless ZF 8 speed in my Alfa, RRS and 6 speed iteration in my GTS, I would own it. I can shift as well as anyone out there after a million or so DC -downshifts. I day in the wife's paddled Miata brought me up to speed on the future.

CRANK WINDOWS ARE PROBABLY ON MOST FOLKS LIST ALSO.....
 

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Not my color but could be my car at some point. I think it's brilliant. Appearance is subjective. Performance is not.
We can make fun of them all we like but they are already sold out for the year.
 

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Coming from a visually driven discipline, I just can’t get past it. I’m not entering any races. But I will be looking at my car every day. Maybe it looks better in the steel. But really it has all the hallmarks of every other cheap knockoff, whether fashion or art or automobile—which is to say, you see what the designer was referencing, but you can also see just how far short it falls in comparison to the original.
 
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I'm not fond of origami touches and the Corvette revels in them. I prefer flowing rather than folded lines but I think the Vette is eye catching enough, at least while it remains a novelty. The Civic Type R (a fine machine otherwise ) is ugly. The CTS is ugly. The Corvette is above that league.

BTW, the part I think is brilliant isn't the styling. It's the overall package.

But I understand why people who prefer a less folded appearance (the rear end!) also find it less pleasing to gaze upon.
 

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Ferrari and Lambo both stopped selling manual transmissions. Let's face it, modern day automatics are faster than you or I will ever be at shifting. But I agree, the manual is more of a driver experience.
The enjoyment I get out of using a manual transmission overshadows the benefits of being a few tenths of a second faster at accelerating in a car that's already more powerful than necessary.

oldmansan said:
The trend away from manual transmissions will only continue to increase. Faster has always been something I want, and then I want more.
I don't really get it. Gaining a few tenths of a second between gears but losing the pleasure of being more connected with the car 99% of the time? Even if it's a full second faster in 0-80. On a commute or a pleasure drive I probably shift a hundred times. The number of times where I push the car to its limits such that I'd notice fractional improvements in performance are very few and far between. I'd have to be on a track to really need it, or in a street race.

Don't people experience the pleasure of a well-matched downshift or the enjoyable challenge of braking, shifting, matching revs, and steering during a nice curve? You feel the car's power transferred exactly as you command it, in a way that requires more skill and finesse than letting a computer do it for you. If you screw it up it's on you--do better next time, the car says.

Throwing away your manual transmission? Hell, why not drive a Tesla at that point?
 

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Acme Super Moderator ** The Enforcer **
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The enjoyment I get out of using a manual transmission overshadows the benefits of being a few tenths of a second faster at accelerating in a car that's already more powerful than necessary.
Both of us (Rizzydee and myself) said we enjoy manual transmissions. That said, if there's a performance car that I'm interested in, and it doesn't have the option of a manual transmission, I personally don't exclude it from consideration. If that's a line in the sand you've drawn, I think everyone here supports your right to do so, but won't necessarily do the same.

I bought a GT-R two years ago. It's an automatic with paddle shifters. It's heavy for a sports car (or whatever you'd care to classify it as). It's sort of a normal car if you want it to be, with a nice interior and easy ingress/egress. It can also be very fast if needed, especially if you push a few buttons. It violates two of my normal preferences, a manual transmission and light weight. Despite that it's a great car. 565HP stock, titanium exhaust, AWD, forged Rays wheels, hand-built twin turbo V6, huge Brembo brakes, customized gauges, blah, blah.

My previous vehicle was a C7, with a 7-speed manual. The 8-speed automatic is faster, but I chose the 7-speed as it wasn't problematic with regards to overheating, usually under extreme conditions (canyons/track). It had the rev-matching feature, which you could disable. GM stated the 7-speed manual was the only transmission that was deemed track capable. If the automatic didn't have issues, I would have considered it.

I have a Tacoma (automatic), GT-R (automatic), Exige S (manual) and 3 motorcycles. The motorcycles have blippers from the factory, so the clutch is only needed for starting and shifting into neutral.

I don't really get it. Gaining a few tenths of a second between gears but losing the pleasure of being more connected with the car 99% of the time? Even if it's a full second faster in 0-80. On a commute or a pleasure drive I probably shift a hundred times. The number of times where I push the car to its limits such that I'd notice fractional improvements in performance are very few and far between. I'd have to be on a track to really need it, or in a street race.

Don't people experience the pleasure of a well-matched downshift or the enjoyable challenge of braking, shifting, matching revs, and steering during a nice curve? You feel the car's power transferred exactly as you command it, in a way that requires more skill and finesse than letting a computer do it for you. If you screw it up it's on you--do better next time, the car says.

Throwing away your manual transmission? Hell, why not drive a Tesla at that point?
A manual can be very pleasing, but there are times when it's not. Stop and go traffic, where you're literally only ever reaching 5-15mph before braking for an hour or two isn't fun. There are also times when a manual isn't an option.

I was working late on my birthday to meet a deadline. I came home and was returning calls to well-wishers. Slipped on a step taking the dog out and tore my left quadricep. I was able to get to work the next day in my Tacoma. Even when I had the left leg in an immobilizer cast I was able to commute to work. It took a couple of months before I could safely drive a manual transmission.

Throwing away a manual transmission isn't really applicable, as we're simply talking about considering vehicles that aren't available with manual transmissions. It doesn't relegate us to a Tesla either. There are plenty of high-end cars that are only available with an automatic.

Demand for manual transmissions has been waning for a long time in the US. The links below are from 2018, but the trend towards automatics continues. Less than 3%, closer to 2% of cars sold in the US have manual transmissions.

https://www.carmax.com/articles/stick-shift-index

http://www.chicagotribune.com/autos/sc-auto-cover-manual-transmissions-20180710-story.html

I learned to drive a manual on the farm, when I was big enough to reach the pedals of a tractor. Most of America's youth don't possess the skill of driving a manual, nor the desire. It is what it is. I think when/if I sell my Exige S it will be because I have to, probably because I physically can't drive it, or some unforeseen situation presents itself.


San
 
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