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Last night I talked to Ronin for the first time regarding forced induction options for the elise, so I decided to share some of the conversation. Franks has always been a large advocate of supercharged solutions. I’ve defiantly been more of a turbo guy but I wanted to see if he could talk me either way. It turns due to some issues with the new supercharger he has now decided to go with a turbo setup on his car. I won’t share the exact details of his setup but I found this to be quite interesting, he is still going to run the modified stock ECU. Now Charlie can tell more and maybe answer some of the details, but Frank said that his ECU currently is running a MAP sensor using some for the extra wires (or at least pin outs) not taken up by the original ecu setup! I tried to get more details of the fuel timing tables but he didn’t know. He can kind of be a tough guy to talk to he’s far from shy or modest about his accomplishments and it’s hard to even get a question in. Despite being a little abrasive he was extremely honest and admitted he didn’t know the high level functionality of the ecu or some of the dynamics of the turbocharger itself, and was more than willing to stay with me on the phone all night to try and answer any questions I had. But now I’m still wondering did Charlie install a map sensor to add as a correction or adjustment to the fuel or actually create a whole additional dimension to the fuel table?

In addition he said a lot of people running piggyback systems get the car tuned properly and the ecu will over time make scalar corrections to the fuel and timing adjustments throwing off the whole tune, and in some cases leading to engine failure. I have experienced similar things in some vehicles but apparently due to the intense internal versatility of the ecu its much more aggressive and worse than the typical vehicle and likewise it’s on a higher class of car. Any comments from individuals who run a force induction system on an elise that have experienced this?
 

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My car has a Hydra ECU, which is a stand alone, and after some adjustments seems to run very solid. My biggest obstical was heat, and after removing the rear panel the problem has gone away. Last time it dyno'd at 324whp and the car was running no where near how well it runs now.

As far as tuning the ECU, I am lost. I know that the car has alot more in it still, but it runs so well now, I hesitate to mess with it. Let me know if I can be of any help.
 

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My car has a Hydra ECU, which is a stand alone, and after some adjustments seems to run very solid. My biggest obstical was heat, and after removing the rear panel the problem has gone away. Last time it dyno'd at 324whp and the car was running no where near how well it runs now.

As far as tuning the ECU, I am lost. I know that the car has alot more in it still, but it runs so well now, I hesitate to mess with it. Let me know if I can be of any help.
x2

Go for the Hydra if you don't want to deal with the EFI. A bunch of Toyotas are being run on the Hydra that has the 2zz engine.
 

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My car has a Hydra ECU, which is a stand alone, and after some adjustments seems to run very solid. My biggest obstical was heat, and after removing the rear panel the problem has gone away. Last time it dyno'd at 324whp and the car was running no where near how well it runs now.

As far as tuning the ECU, I am lost. I know that the car has alot more in it still, but it runs so well now, I hesitate to mess with it. Let me know if I can be of any help.
What engine mods are you running and with what size turbo?
 

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when talking to ronin make sure you've got voice minutes! :)
+1 And NEVER put him on speaker if there are children or ladies present! I'd say he swears like a sailor, but he actually is a sailor so its to be expected ;)


Seriously though - Frank is an awsome guy once you get to know him - hes a little rough around the edges but who isn't.
 

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I talked to him once and he was easy to talk to - I think it must have been his evil twin that used to post here.

turbo, hmm. Still running the dreaded eManage and turbo here on my '05 with no issues other than marginal idle. Even passed full on inspection including OBDII connection to state-required computer.

MAP sensor? makes sense to me, I tried to figure out how anyone was going to reflash the existing ECU and deal with a turbo and the fact that boost pressure can vary so much at a given engine rpm, especially if you have a boost controller and change boost settings from time to time. I alwyas thought the supercharged option was easier to tuen at WOT, simply because the boost at any given rpm is fixed by the pulley drive. My eManage piggyback maps are all boost dependent so I can add fuel and retard timing as needed.

Good for Frank - I am sure he will go all out.
 

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The 2871 is big for this car unless you want maximum power without caring about throttle response. Especially on a built motre. If you care about maintaining more linear power delivery and run a 28R or 28RS. The XP car in my Avatar is running 325 rwhp on stock motor with 28RS. Only difference is EFI standalone and serious race gas. This setup is probably good for 300RWHP on 93 pump gas.
 

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Fred,
The throttle response and control I get in the car is amazing. I was worried about the same thing. I am running 16 psi and have no problems at all on the track. When I roll on the throttle it is smooth. The only slight lag I notice is from 4th gear to 5th and 5th to 6th. It feels just like a slight fade in power and nothing more. Other than that I have no complaints.

If you are ever in central Florida I would love for you to drive it and give me your feedback.
 

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I have driven This car and it is simply amazing! A little bit of lag but that was to be expected since I am used to the throttle response of my Ronin/Katana - I think there is room for improvement in the tune but that is about it!
 

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I have driven This car and it is simply amazing! A little bit of lag but that was to be expected since I am used to the throttle response of my Ronin/Katana - I think there is room for improvement in the tune but that is about it!
To be clear, you are saying "because the Katana doesn't have any perceptible lag...", correct?

I would still like to know specifically why Frank decided to go TC after all that investment in SC.
 

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because he wants power that isn't available with the SC setups. He had the MP62 pretty much maxed out. His first attempt with Works Power was to make a replacement blower that would deliver the hp and torque he wanted but we all saw how that ended. It has been proven that a turbo will deliver that power and more.
 

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ZTEC,

Since the heat problems are gone, the lag is gone. Come back out and visit sometime.

I have driven This car and it is simply amazing! A little bit of lag but that was to be expected since I am used to the throttle response of my Ronin/Katana - I think there is room for improvement in the tune but that is about it!
 

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he probably wanted serious TQ that you cant get from a supercharger.

like fzust said, if you run a gt28rs you should be fine, we have tuned them to 330whp/330wtq+ on 93 ocatane on daily driven street cars and you wont want much more than that in a little car like this.
 

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he probably wanted serious TQ that you cant get from a supercharger.

like fzust said, if you run a gt28rs you should be fine, we have tuned them to 330whp/330wtq+ on 93 ocatane on daily driven street cars and you wont want much more than that in a little car like this.
Thanks to both dustylax and ZJChaser for clarifying.

Man, I can't imagine what that kind of torque would feel like on this car! Seems like it would be nearly impossible to control, especially with much lag.

Had a chance to drive a GT3 RS the other day after driving a friends 996 TT... the instant power on the RS was SO intoxicating! And, even though the 996 TT was fast... the RS felt tons more controlable.

thanks...
 

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Discussion Starter #20
I talked to him once and he was easy to talk to - I think it must have been his evil twin that used to post here.

turbo, hmm. Still running the dreaded eManage and turbo here on my '05 with no issues other than marginal idle. Even passed full on inspection including OBDII connection to state-required computer.

MAP sensor? makes sense to me, I tried to figure out how anyone was going to reflash the existing ECU and deal with a turbo and the fact that boost pressure can vary so much at a given engine rpm, especially if you have a boost controller and change boost settings from time to time. I alwyas thought the supercharged option was easier to tuen at WOT, simply because the boost at any given rpm is fixed by the pulley drive. My eManage piggyback maps are all boost dependent so I can add fuel and retard timing as needed.

Good for Frank - I am sure he will go all out.
How long have you had the eManage running on the car (# of miles)? Yeah the MAP sensor seems crazy to me I would assume there would have to be logic in the circuit board to interrupt the output of the sensor, and a reflash alone will not cut it. Which is were I started to get real frustrated with Frank, it took almost an hour before he told me he even had a map sensor. He was really pushing using the stock ecu with just a Charlie tune, but this is clearly more than a tune job, he's adding additional inputs into the ecu and defiantly some programming if not whole new timing and fuel tables. I'm curious how far the modification really is?
 
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