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Discussion Starter #1
I'm considering upgrading my rear speakers to these. Any info on exact model of the installed speakers.

They say Polk have good bass response. I may also need some sort of deadening to stop the plastic behind the seats from vibrating. Has anyone one else noticed vibrations when the speakers are up?
 

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Derek said:
I'm considering upgrading my rear speakers to these. Any info on exact model of the installed speakers.

They say Polk have good bass response. I may also need some sort of deadening to stop the plastic behind the seats from vibrating. Has anyone one else noticed vibrations when the speakers are up?
DAYUM that is sweet! Thanks bro I'm gonna go this route for sure :clap:
 

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Discussion Starter #3
Re: Re: Speaker Upgrade!

1FASTMX5 said:
DAYUM that is sweet! Thanks bro I'm gonna go this route for sure :clap:
The cut outs for the stock speakers is almost 5". I may have to go with the MMC650 instead. There is still the question of depth. I'm not sure how much room is back there.
 

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MMC650 can be found as low as $144.00 delivered. Not to bad. The only thing I wonder is if you just change the back and not the front the speakers upfront will distort. This in turn will limit the bass and volumn of the rear. I wish I could crossover only higher frequencies to the front and allow the rears to operate the full range that they can.
 

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On the topic of speaker upgrades, has anyone measured the holes for the speakers? I'd like to know the cutout size, and the spacing of the screw holes, and the depth available behind the mounting panel.
 

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Jon, more likely a owner can confirm and give you more details. Believe it's 4.5" for fronts and around 5.25" for rear. Think the rear has a very sallow mounting depth. The Pioneer bass tube is only 4" and 50 watts, not likely to get much real bass out of it. Use to have a Bazooka RS 6.5" self power (80-100w) in the MR2. Might give it a try in the Elise.
 

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Speaker size

I believe they are 5 1/4" in the dash & 6 1/2" behind the seats.
It looks like the Polks may stick out too far for the tweeters and may hit the back of the seats, but they do sound good.

Me personally, I'm either going with the Alpine Type R's or JL Audio VR Series with a JL Audio 300/4 amp.

I'm also ripping out the crappy Blajunk-made-by-Sony radio.

Bruce
 

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I am a HUGE Polk Audio fan. I think they and Inifinity are the best values for the money. Can't really go wrong with either brand. I wouldn't worry about the base. If you upgrade to good speakers like these you'll get enough audible bass to drive to. I upgraded the 5 1/4" drivers in my car and I got a ton more bass out of them - more so than the "subwoofer" of the original car system. Those speakers look like they will do a great job in the car. Might want to get newer 5 1/4" speakers with seperate tweeters also. With the seperate tweeters you can aim the high frequency sound at the passengers better plus there generally is a crossover in the package. Low frequency sound isn't directional so it doesn't matter, but high freq stuff does. Do everything at once & get it done with.

The mmc650's have a low end range of 43 Hz. That's getting down to sound that's so low you can't really hear it & it's more of
vibration. And with a car's poor audioscape it doesn't matter too much anyhow. I know the audiophiles here will beat me up over that but for all practical purposes it just doesn't matter. Only a powered subwoofer would be able to make a noticable difference.

Install Dimensions
Full-range Mounting Depth:
Top Mount - 2-7/16" (6.19cm)
Bottom Mount - 2-9/16" (6.51cm)
Tweeter Mounting:
Surface Mount Height - 1/2" (1.27cm)
Cut-out:
Driver Cut-out Diameter - 5" (12.70cm)

I didn't notice how close the seats were to the speakers when I was in the demo but with only a 1/2" height to them it would be hard to see an issue.
 

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1FASTMX5 said:
MMC650 can be found as low as $144.00 delivered. Not to bad. The only thing I wonder is if you just change the back and not the front the speakers upfront will distort. This in turn will limit the bass and volume of the rear. I wish I could crossover only higher frequencies to the front and allow the rears to operate the full range that they can.
Why would swapping out just one set cause distortion? I haven't heard of the before.

And you can get crossovers from most places that are high, mid or low bypass. Crutchfield.com has them pretty cheap. It's common to do exactly what you're talking about.
 

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The reason why the front speakers would distort if you only change the back speakers is because the back speakers can now be driven to higher volumn levels to which the fronts can't handle without distorting. Considering a neutral fade between front and back, the higher and more efficient capacity of the back would easily exceed the terrible front mounted speakers. You would really need to replace them all to keep things in balance and sounding smooth and distortaion free at all volumns and frequncy ranges. One could try to use a crossover for the fronts in an attemp to keep bass from them in an attempt to keep them distorting but it would probably cause excessive treble of the total sound.
 

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OH OH OH - I get it now. Sorry I wasn't thinking about that. Good point. It's the idea of getting speakers with the same sensitivity / THD.

For those that don't know:

Sensitivity/ efficiency is measured in Db's. It's a measure of how efficiently a speaker produces sound. You measure it by powering the speaker with 1 watt of power and placing a mic 1 meter away. How loud that sound is the "efficiency" of the speaker. If you get speakers with different efficiencies when you turn the power up to a speaker then the more efficient ones will be louder and it will screw up the balance between the speakers. Higher efficiency of a speaker doesn't mean it's better. It's only important to get speakers that are close or the same in efficiency.

THD - Total Harmonic Distortion aka "Thud". It a measure of how accurate the speaker reproduces the sound. The lower the better, it is a good indicator of how good a speaker is. THD is measure on speakers as well as Amps. In factory cars the car stereo's amps are usually THD %'s are better than the speakers so a quick speaker upgrade can really make the system alot better. Ok: .10% or less, Good: .05% or less, Great: .01 or less. I have a Sony ES home Theatre system with less than .005% if I remember correctly. Freaking awesome with my Polk's.

The closer you get to a speaker's input max the more distortion you will get so 1FASTMX5's comment was spot on.

When you "voice match" speakers it's just getting speakers with the same efficiency and THD so when you turn them up they all sound equally good/poor.
 

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Discussion Starter #13
Re: Speaker size

BMJM100 said:
I believe they are 5 1/4" in the dash & 6 1/2" behind the seats.
It looks like the Polks may stick out too far for the tweeters and may hit the back of the seats, but they do sound good.

Me personally, I'm either going with the Alpine Type R's or JL Audio VR Series with a JL Audio 300/4 amp.

I'm also ripping out the crappy Blajunk-made-by-Sony radio.

Bruce
I also thought about an amp as the speaker upgrade is kinda wasted money without one. But have you ever looked at the battery in the Liz? It's tiny! My concern is that an amp, even a small 200 watt one will suck too much power and kill the battery.

After doing some reseach I was very close to getting the Rockford Fosgate X152S
I have included a picture of these as well as a picture of the stock speakers.

But decided that it would be a waste as I would need an amp to drive them and didn't want to install one due to power draw.

BTW the speakers are 5.25 in the rear. I didn't remove the front set so I can't say with certainty what size they are.

A. Stock rear speakers.

B. Rockford Fosgate X152S
 

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The Amp upgrade isn't really worth it unless you want to listen to music at a higher volume. Amps only make sound louder, not necessarily better. For the Elise just getting new speakers should be good enough if you're not looking to build a show car. If you want to build an excellent quality system then yes, new head unit, amps & speakers are required.

I keep my radio at a lower volume most of the time when I drive. When I hear certian songs I'll turn it up. The only time I'm really listening to music is on longer trips. For me, I knew that upgrading my speakers was good enough. It would be nice to have a better stereo for long distance but it just wasn't worth the time or $ to do it.

A good $500 or less in speakers for the 'liz will make a world of difference. If you heard just the speaker upgrade you wouldn't care about messing with amps. New head unit maybe... ;)
 

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Discussion Starter #15
The radio volume knob can go from 1-50 (if I recall) however past 24~25 it starts to distort. If you want to run your speakers at there RMS (sustained output) distortion free you will need an amp.
If you're looking to bypass the amp then the stock head unit has the highest sustained output I've seen. A few watts above my $900 Alpine head unit. In truth Lotus was not cheap on the head unit, they went cheap with the speakers. The stock speakers are the cheapest model that Blaupunkt makes.

IMO a valid reason to upgrade just the speakers would be if you want your speaker to have more mid-bass but not be louder. Clearly some speakers are biased toward bass and some are biased towards hi tones. I think the stock speakers are the latter. The RF are the former.
Regardless you won't be able to get any more distortion free volume without an amp.

I'm kinda stuck as I don't want to install an amp and risk other problems.
 

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Agreed.

How many watt amp do you want? What about getting a nice size capacitor with the Amp? That might elliminate the battery issue. Less than a 200 watt amp should be no problem.
 

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Discussion Starter #17
Lotus Fury said:
Agreed.

How many watt amp do you want? What about getting a nice size capacitor with the Amp? That might elliminate the battery issue. Less than a 200 watt amp should be no problem.
I've thought about that and really don't want a very complicated audio setup in a car that focuses on light weight.

Another concern is the lack of any shop manual to explain how to dismantle the dash to facilitate installation of the wiring for the front speaker pair. My dealer said the front was complicated and there really are no experienced audio installers.
 

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So no headrest TVs? damn. That would have been a very nice thing to do for the people behind you. :D

Maybe post a question on SELOC asking if there are any how-to's to take the radio out easily. I know the US dash is "different" but I'm sure that the differences are mostly cosmetic and that the procedure for taking our dash/radio apart is about the same for theirs.

I just check my own website and found something:

Dash info
 

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Keep in mind that the Elise is not exactly a quiet car. I'm not sure that you could actually notice any improvement in the sound quality. I'm happy with the stock radio and speakers for what little bit I use the radio.
 

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I intend to upgrade the back speakers to start, and will measure the depth tonight. I'll post it once I know.
 
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