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I own a bone stock '04 Audi S4 (340 hp V8, awd and 6MT) as my "daily driver", and a heavily modified '03 Nissan 350Z Track as my racetrack and weekend car. A great trade for both would be an '05 Mitsu EVO MR (or RS) for the street, and an Elise or a C6 Corvette for the track.

Choices, choices, choices . . .
 

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I own both: US-spec STi and Fed-Elise. In a straight line, where torque and traction matter, the STi is effortlessly faster than the Elise. Around a track, it will all depend on the track layout. If it's a "momentum" track where carrying speed through corners is most important, the Elise should be faster.

But when folks talk about handling, it's more about the dynamics of the car than the absolute lap times. With the STi in stock form, you'll be fighting the car around the track. With the Elise, she'll do exactly what you tell her - it's exceptionally rewarding when done right. That is why the Elise is the superior "track car" (not "race car") in stock form.
 

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Derek said:
This “No Replacement for Displacement” “Bigger is better” BS is ridiculous. Especially when applied to the STI and even more so on a Lotus forum.

Can someone please enlighten me as to why, anyone in their right mind would buy a US STI and be happy with the fact that they changed the engine to the 2.5 liter from the legacy?

Is the STI faster than the WRX?

Then that is why I would get the STI.

It is also not the same 2.5 that is in the Legacy.
 

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i think some of this talk about "fighting" an sti or an evo around a track and how the elise will just "do what u tell her," is kinda bs...
i believe the track would have to very tight and technical for the elise to have the advantage....i believe the reason u think u need to "fight" the evo or sti around a track is perhaps its entering the corners a bit quicker??
 

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evomind said:
i think some of this talk about "fighting" an sti or an evo around a track and how the elise will just "do what u tell her," is kinda bs...
i believe the track would have to very tight and technical for the elise to have the advantage....i believe the reason u think u need to "fight" the evo or sti around a track is perhaps its entering the corners a bit quicker??
Drive them both on the track and then tell me again I'm full of BS. Or perhaps you prefer a car that both understeers and does not take well to line-trimming corrections using the throttle?

(I haven't driven the EVO on the track, so my comments only apply to the STi vs Elise. Perhaps the EVO is a better track car out of the box than the STi (a lot of people seem to have that notion).)
 

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The Evo and STI fight everything - the road, themselves. I've observed both at autocrosses countless times. They work the drivetrain elements very hard, and really excercise the brake pads and tires. Fast, fun cars though, but a bit like a Bull in a China shop. The Elise is much less dramatic in doing it's thing. more efficient if you will.
 

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the evo and sti are similar in that they are both awd cars, but the narrower focus of the evo gives it an edge at a track....
im sure both cars mile per hour faster than the elise everywhere except the tightest twisties though....(that was kinda my point...maybe ur fighting it, but i think its going faster too.)
maybe im wrong.....interesting call though :)
 

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In terms of modulation and the driver's ability to induce various states, is cornering speed relevant if both cars are compared at the limit? Seems like an irrelevant point (speed of the corner), in terms of handling dynamics. Perhaps a ploy to boost the Evo?

In either case, the Autocar test shows both the 111R and Exige cornering at higher speeds (and higher g's) than the Evo VIII MR FQ-340 in the selected corners. The 111R was slower around the track, but the Exige edged the Evo out. How much the downforce helps, remains to be seen. I would call it a draw with the Fed Elise w/sport pack on that particular track, and then you are left to ponder which is your preferred driving philosophy.

In real world driving, I don't doubt the Evo is the faster car. Traction and torque are more heavily weighted than nimbleness and cornering speed at the limit.
 

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well i meant in overall lap times i thought the evo or sti would be faster except in a very tricky, twisty track....
i dont know, but thats my impression from driving both cars...
interesting race though....
 

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When comparing the US STI Impreza against the European Impreza (WR1), don't forget that we in the UK also have access to all of the Jap cars too.

So in essence our top Impreza would be the Spec C. This would be the Impreza of choice as both a track car and road car. It can put out lap times equal to that of the Porche GT3 :bow:
 

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evomind said:
[B
i believe the track would have to very tight and technical for the elise to have the advantage.... [/B]
What like Spa Francorchamps??

Too many comments about comparisons on track are rubbish. I completely obliterated a Subaru WR1 around Spa earlier this year, not to mention numerous Porsche GT3's, in fact the only one that put up a fight was the all new lightweight Porsche 911GT3RS, and that was only on the straights, unfortunatly Spa has some very long fast straights, so he did edge away over a few laps. The only thing that blasted past me was a Radical.

Comparisons are useless as even the same driver wouldn't get the best out of each car.

Just drive what you like and don't get drawn into pissing contests as there is a situation where whatever the cars being compared one will be better than the other.
 

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i didnt really realize it was a pissing contest....
however i AM selling my highly modified evo to buy the elise if that makes anyone feel better....:)
 

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Mark A said:
What like Spa Francorchamps??

Too many comments about comparisons on track are rubbish. I completely obliterated a Subaru WR1 around Spa earlier this year, not to mention numerous Porsche GT3's, in fact the only one that put up a fight was the all new lightweight Porsche 911GT3RS, and that was only on the straights, unfortunatly Spa has some very long fast straights, so he did edge away over a few laps. The only thing that blasted past me was a Radical.

Comparisons are useless as even the same driver wouldn't get the best out of each car.

Just drive what you like and don't get drawn into pissing contests as there is a situation where whatever the cars being compared one will be better than the other.
Is your car completely stock and were the GT3 drivers equally skilled?
 

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Mark A said:
What like Spa Francorchamps??

Too many comments about comparisons on track are rubbish. I completely obliterated a Subaru WR1 around Spa earlier this year, not to mention numerous Porsche GT3's, in fact the only one that put up a fight was the all new lightweight Porsche 911GT3RS, and that was only on the straights, unfortunatly Spa has some very long fast straights, so he did edge away over a few laps. The only thing that blasted past me was a Radical.

Comparisons are useless as even the same driver wouldn't get the best out of each car.

Just drive what you like and don't get drawn into pissing contests as there is a situation where whatever the cars being compared one will be better than the other.
I'm not sure how you managed to do that in an Exige. The GT3's have so much power, any advantage you make on the twisties would be completly wasted as they should easily outdrag you on the straights.
 

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Yargk,

That's exactly the point I was getting at, there are so many variables and even with the same driver in each car the variables still exist.
My car isn't too modified. It has slightly stiffer springs and dampers and running on Yoko AO48's, it also has the Lotus official upgrade from 177bhp to 190bhp (although it was bloody hot so had the aircon on :D).

Gedi,

Mostly through carrying speed through the corners, I was exiting Eau Rouge at approx 110-115mph and catching the Porsche, but he would then blast down the straights and over the next 5-6 bends I'd pull it all back, it took 2 laps before I wasn't able to pull it all back and he slowly started to edge away. He was being cautious, sensible I suppose as a brand new Porsche 911GT3 had already been written off in the barriers at the top of Eau Rouge in the morning. But where I was pulling 130mph through Blanchimont he was probably only doing 110mph at most.
 

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The Subaru vs. Elise debate comes down to this for me:
I'm sure there are plenty of modern, high performance 4x4s from BMW and Mercedes that are faster around a circuit than a 1980's Countach, but I'd still rather be seen driving around in the Lamborghini than a truck.

Same goes with the Subaru. I'm sure that a modded WRX STi could destroy an Elise on a track, but you're still driving a boxy sedan. :(
 

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mick:up: NO arguments there, don't care if EVERY other car in the world is faster than me, I LOOK DAMN GOOD IN IT!:D
Chris

PS, can personally vouch that Mick in NO WAY resembles Angelina Jolie even on his best day;)
 
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