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Anyone know if there is someone working on a Bose-like waveguise subwoofer package? Those Bose systems use very small drivers (3"?)
I'm not looking for thumping base, just a rich full sound out of the stereo.
 

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a few things to consider here... first of all, free air subwoofers will not work in the elise. a free air woofer is designed to be placed in a baffle board which seperates two sections of a vehicle, typically in between the trunk and the rear seats. they are called free air because they use the entire trunk air space as the enclosure. since the typical trunk is pretty large by speaker enclosure standards, it looks effectively infinite to the woofer and so a free air woofer is designed to function most efficiently as the enclosure space gets large.

ported boxes provide the highest output but only around the tuning frequency of the port. ported boxes typically need 2-3 times the volume that the same woofer would use in a sealed configuration. ported enclosures also suffer from large amounts of woofer excursion below the tuning frequency which means that a box tuned to say 40hz will have very little output below that but twice as much output at 40 hz than an equivalent sealed box.

bandpass boxes are very efficient around the tuning frequency at which the box is tuned but they tend to be twice the volume of the equivalent ported box. one possibility with the elise for someone who really wants a decent amount of bass is to build a bandpass box in the trunk area and then direct the bass into the passenger area using a port running from the trunk into the passenger compartment. this would require a 2-3" diameter tube being run somewhere inside the rear clam and then tuning the box so that final length of the port works out to be correct for the size of the box. i have no idea if this is even possible since i have not pulled the back off of my elise yet but it would by far allow for the best bass if it was possible.

also consider that modern auto subwoofers rely on using the vehicle transfer function (sound amplification by the vehicle interior characteristics) to produce adequate levels of low frequencies. open top vehicles have no transfer function when the top is off so you end up either designing for the top off which gives an inordinate amount of bass when the top is put on or design for the top on and have minimal bass when the top is off. ideally an active equalization switch is needed to adjust the sound for a top on/off condition similar to what the new lexus convertible has.

the ideal solution for the elise is going to be a sealed 8" woofer. jl audio ad phoenix gold both make nice woofers that work very well in small sealed enclosures. i am defianetly adding a subwoofer to mine and im going to build it using composite materials, either an aramide fiber or kevlar with fiberglass. if the sub faces forward, then it helps to mount a baffle plate 1" in front of the face of the sub; it will protect the sub and provide a footrest and more importantly, it will act to stabilize the woofer excursion, allowing better response when the top is off. the total weight of the box should be just under 1 lb with the woofer adding another 2-4 lbs.
 

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rob13572468 said:
a few things to consider here... first of all, free air subwoofers will not work in the elise. a free air woofer is designed to be placed in a baffle board which seperates two sections of a vehicle, typically in between the trunk and the rear seats. they are called free air because they use the entire trunk air space as the enclosure. since the typical trunk is pretty large by speaker enclosure standards, it looks effectively infinite to the woofer and so a free air woofer is designed to function most efficiently as the enclosure space gets large.

ported boxes provide the highest output but only around the tuning frequency of the port. ported boxes typically need 2-3 times the volume that the same woofer would use in a sealed configuration. ported enclosures also suffer from large amounts of woofer excursion below the tuning frequency which means that a box tuned to say 40hz will have very little output below that but twice as much output at 40 hz than an equivalent sealed box.

bandpass boxes are very efficient around the tuning frequency at which the box is tuned but they tend to be twice the volume of the equivalent ported box. one possibility with the elise for someone who really wants a decent amount of bass is to build a bandpass box in the trunk area and then direct the bass into the passenger area using a port running from the trunk into the passenger compartment. this would require a 2-3" diameter tube being run somewhere inside the rear clam and then tuning the box so that final length of the port works out to be correct for the size of the box. i have no idea if this is even possible since i have not pulled the back off of my elise yet but it would by far allow for the best bass if it was possible.

also consider that modern auto subwoofers rely on using the vehicle transfer function (sound amplification by the vehicle interior characteristics) to produce adequate levels of low frequencies. open top vehicles have no transfer function when the top is off so you end up either designing for the top off which gives an inordinate amount of bass when the top is put on or design for the top on and have minimal bass when the top is off. ideally an active equalization switch is needed to adjust the sound for a top on/off condition similar to what the new lexus convertible has.

the ideal solution for the elise is going to be a sealed 8" woofer. jl audio ad phoenix gold both make nice woofers that work very well in small sealed enclosures. i am defianetly adding a subwoofer to mine and im going to build it using composite materials, either an aramide fiber or kevlar with fiberglass. if the sub faces forward, then it helps to mount a baffle plate 1" in front of the face of the sub; it will protect the sub and provide a footrest and more importantly, it will act to stabilize the woofer excursion, allowing better response when the top is off. the total weight of the box should be just under 1 lb with the woofer adding another 2-4 lbs.
Make an extra and I would gladly pay you for it plus your time. :)
 

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ok, i took some measurements today down by the passenger footwell (boy was that fun) and it looks as if there will be enough room to build an enclosure for an 8" sub while leaving the passenger footrest in the same position. the preliminary specs would be most likely using a jl audio 8w0 in a .36 cu ft enclosure which would give the woofer a q of ~0.7 and would fill out the low end nicely. jl also makes a 6W0 which might actually be better for this application though i have never built an enclosure using that model so some experimentation would be in order.

The only other option would be to build an enclosure between and behind the seats that replaces the rear panel. it would essentially be a drop in replacement that curves out in the center to form the sub enclosure and would be wrapped in matching leather. this would allow for more volume behind the woofer which would increase the response with the top off but would also increase the weight, complexity and therefore cost. when i had my del sol, i went through 4 different enclosure types before i settled on this type with a 10w6 and it performed very well.

under the circumstances, im leaning towards the footrest enclosure since space is already at a premium and such a configuration would make the most efficient use of the space. if the enclosure works well then ill be happy to make a reverse and mold additional enclosures for anyone interested. ill post more as things progress.
 

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rob13572468 said:
under the circumstances, im leaning towards the footrest enclosure since space is already at a premium and such a configuration would make the most efficient use of the space. if the enclosure works well then ill be happy to make a reverse and mold additional enclosures for anyone interested. ill post more as things progress.
Please keep all of us informed. :bow:
 

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Clarion SRV303

I have found the solution for the subwoofer. I just got it yeasterday and installed it last night. It is the Clarion SRV303. It cost $249 from crutchfield and is a 7" 120W amplified Subwoofer.

It fits perfectly on the back shelf behind the drivers seat. I removed the cargo net and fastened it to the plastic shelf. Dependeng on how you mount it, it can be easily removed for those who go to the track. Best of all wiring was easy. I tapped into the power for the auxillary plug. Running the cables and remote on/off wire from the radio was the only tough part. Elise doesn't make it east when you want to run wires.

Best part is that with my Alpine Head unit and upgraded speakers, I don't need to add an additional amp. This subwoofer fills in the missing Bass that my car needed.

I will post pictures of the it installed in my car when I get it back from my dealer. I'm having my 1000 mile service and a few querks fixed.



It's one of the handiest bass machines you'll ever find. Clarion's SRV303 powered subwoofer combines a 7" speaker with a built-in amplifier (64 watts RMS/120 peak) in a super-compact ported enclosure. It'll go places where a normal sub won't fit (under the front seat of your small car, for instance). You'll be amazed that so much bass can go into such a small place.

The low-pass filter lets you adjust the bass to fit your vehicle (selectable at 50, 75, 100, or 120 Hz), while the phase switch maximizes the sub's performance. You can hook up this versatile unit in any car, thanks to its preamp- and speaker-level inputs. And, if you like to adjust your bass on the fly, the control panel is detachable and comes with a 16-foot cable for remote use.

Key Features:

» die-cast aluminum ported enclosure
» 7" subwoofer
» detachable control panel with cable (contains gain, crossover, and phase controls)
» built-in amplifier (64 watts RMS/120 peak)
» preamp- and speaker-level inputs
» low-pass filter (selectable at 50/75/100/120Hz)
» frequency response 30-200 Hz
» 13-5/8"W x 2-15/16"H x 9-1/8"D1 x 9-1/8"D2
» warranty: 1 year

General
Enclosure Type Ported
Finish Material Aluminum
Grille Metal
Connector Type Molex
Bi-amp Inputs No
Woofer Size (inches) 7
Woofer Material Not Given
Passive Radiator None
Width 13-5/8"
Height 2-15/16"
Depth 9-1/8"
Second Depth 9-1/8"
Parts Warranty 1 Year
Labor Warranty 1 Year
Specifications
Frequency Response 30-200 Hz
Amplifier Power (RMS) 64 watts
Maximum Wattage 120 watts
Sensitivity N/A
Impedance N/A
Second Voice Coil Impedance N/A
Crossover Point 50,75,100,120

http://www.crutchfield.com/S-F6gQ68JVacr/cgi-bin/ProdView.asp?g=51000&id=morephotos&i=020SRV303
 

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Have you tested your alarm's motion sensor to see if this amp/sub is blocking the sensor?
 

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and its aluminIum=D so it will look in place
 

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MattG said:
Have you tested your alarm's motion sensor to see if this amp/sub is blocking the sensor?
It does partialy block the sensor. I ahven't yet had the oportunity to determine if it severely effects the sensor yet. If it does, I'll just move the sensor up on the wall. No big deal.
 

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mrluky said:
and its aluminIum=D so it will look in place
Since its aluminum, it does go with the looks of the interior. However, it does not give the impression of being stock since it has a big Clarion label on it. But to really see it, you need to slide the drivers seat up.

Also, the aluminum is a very thin sheet over plastic. Kind of like what volvo does to plastic interior trim pieces to make them look aluminum. I would not be supprised if it is some thype of spray on aluminum coating. Thats why I don't think it will intefere to bad with the motion sensor.

It sounds great though!!! Even with the Top off. I'm really glad I didn't need to mount an amp and place a sub in the foot well. I never really liked the idea of a speaker in the foot well for a number of reasons.

My car is getting a new windshield today so hopefully I can pick it up tommarrow and post some pictures. Of course that depends on this snow storm we're suposed to get. With my luck I won't get the car back till Monday.
 

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My biggest concern is that the max 120w power is really way to low for a subwoofer. That power isnt even continuous but just peek power. I bought a Panasonic digital powered reciever that is 70w RMS. I think that might overpower the sound of the sub. :confused: not sure if this would work. I do look forward to rob13572468 project and hope it would have more punch.
 

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Discussion Starter · #54 ·
I used to have the kenwood version of a powered minsub in the Elise. It sounded pretty good within it's limits but was certainly no thumper. It did not have enough output for satisfactory top down highway use but was okay with the top on. It weighed about 7 pounds and I set it up with a plug in wiring so that it was easy to remove for autocross.
 

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Next Tuesday I am having a Bazooka 6" sub mounted behind the driver's seat on the ledge. It proportedly will be removable and is supposed to supply ample base for a cockpit the size of our cars, and will be wired from the battery. I'll report back once it's in. It was $150 + $75 to install, not bad.

This combined with my Crutchfield-supplied Kenwood component systen should yield good results. BTW-the installer buried the crossovers under the speakers behind the back plastic wall (he dug out some extra foam). All you can see different right now are two little tweeters next to the speakers. :up:
 

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Surferjer- Use to have a 6" RS Bazooka in my MR2 (switch to a 8" JL), decent little sub. For the Elise it would take the whole shelf and block the cargo net. Not going to bother with it. Have some 4” a/d/s , I’ll drop in the front.

The stereo while not great isn’t as bad as I was expecting… then again with this car it hasn’t matter much yet. Will look at a 6.5” JL sub for a little bit better low ends when the time comes.
 

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1FASTMX5 said:
My biggest concern is that the max 120w power is really way to low for a subwoofer. That power isnt even continuous but just peek power. I bought a Panasonic digital powered reciever that is 70w RMS. I think that might overpower the sound of the sub. :confused: not sure if this would work. I do look forward to rob13572468 project and hope it would have more punch.
You have to realize it's powering a 7" Subso it doesn't need as much power as a 10 or 12" speaker. Even though it is a 7" speaker, it is ported and does perform well. An example would be the Bose subwoofers wich are small and sound great.

I believe my Alpine unit (9835) puts out more than your pioneer deck. By no means does this sub overpower my speakers. But I have Polk Momos in the back and MB Quarts in the front. The whole trick is that you need to tune the car's speakers and Radio to your listening pleasure. I am very happy my sound system now. It has great highs, great mids, and a good low bass with a punch.

Does it compare to a 12 inch sub? No not really, but I'm not into car shaking rap music. I have my system tuned for Jazz and Rock. My system now sounds beter than the stock system that came in my Volvo XC90, which is possibly the best stock system I have ever heard. I guess that doesn't mean much to those of you who have not listened to a CD in the XC90.
 

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scottyb said:
You have to realize it's powering a 7" Subso it doesn't need as much power as a 10 or 12" speaker. Even though it is a 7" speaker, it is ported and does perform well. An example would be the Bose subwoofers wich are small and sound great.

I believe my Alpine unit (9835) puts out more than your pioneer deck. By no means does this sub overpower my speakers. But I have Polk Momos in the back and MB Quarts in the front. The whole trick is that you need to tune the car's speakers and Radio to your listening pleasure.
]Let me clarify. My Panasonic digital head unit puts out 70RMS watts per channel. 4X70 = 280watts RMS Total. I highly doubt the Alpine can do that. It is not true what you believe about smaller woofers needing less power. There are many 6-10" woofers that take well over 200wats RMS. Consider that woofers need to physically move air to be effective, and requires more power. Tweeters and mid range speakers utilize most of the power to generate sound and move very little air. Subwoofer power needs to be at least double of what the high range speakers are generating.

SurferJer, I had considered doing the same exact thing with the 6" tube. Bazooka also make a 250 watt RMS version. I didnt think it would fit. Do you know for sure it will? I will definately do it if it does.
 

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Larry-thanks for the note. I think mine is a lot smaller (maybe they've shrunk), but I'll find out next week. The installer thought it would hide completely behind the drivers seat. I hope so. I don't care about the sonsor, but I don't want the use of that very handy cargo net.
 
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