[RacingDynamcs]

I have been skipping a long some great japanese tuners websites lately and one thing couhg my eye on the Top secret japan website... the mr2 spider w/ the 1zz-ge can achieve 300BHP with their t25 turbo kit. Could i assume the same set up on the 2zz-ge will produce similar engine power?

here is the link

http://www.topsecretjpn.com/aerokit/mrs/mrs.html

 

[LarryB]

A t25 is a big turbo. If you want that kind of power from a 1.8 liter, high compression motor. Sure it can be done. Tear the motor down rebulid it with beefed up parts, lower the compression. Properly fit the turbo and everything that goes along with it into a very tight package, making sure the I/C is properly coooling it, a fair amount of tuning, run in on race gas. To do it right you'll need to change the tire package & most likely the suspension. So for a lot of time, effort and $$$, your get a car that wickedly fast, if you can even keep it hooked up. With such a big turbo running higher boost there'll be lot of lag to deal with.

I'm sure somebody will try to get big power out of the Elise with a turbo... it'll be fun to watch how it turns out.

 

[RacingDynamcs]

A lot of new dual berring turbo's w/ 82% eff lvl have no lag and near full boost at nearing 2000rpm

 

[Samurai]

I'm not saying it can't\shouldn't be done, but there aren't too many people with turbos on MR2 Spyders. There are some that have them, but from what I have seen most of them are not stable. The ones that are are small turbos. I would think that big ones would need some motor changes. Just what I have seen over the years.

 

[smoseley]

You'd be better off doing an engine swap for a powerplant MADE to be turbo'ed, similar to what they did with the Elise Esthi.

 

[Samurai]

I'm not sure if the 2ZZ engine has the same problems, but the 1ZZ in the spyder has problems with oil getting past the rings in the engine. Nobody really knows what the cause is. Both engines has a high compression, and I'm not sure adding any more pressure is going to help our engine.

 

[L8BRAKR]

FYI the 1zz is 10:1 vs. the 2zz's 11.5:1 compression, I don't know anything about the oiling problem but I certainly hope it's not around when they start putting the lumps in our cars.

 

[Samurai]

The problem with the 1ZZ is that it seems hat the cats fail and piece get sucked into the engine. This causes the rings to wear and leak oil. That least that is the current thinking on the boards. I have heard about a few other toyota cars, using the same engine, that may be having the same problems. I haven't heard too much about the 2ZZ. I'm hoping they don't have the same problem show up later.

 

[gotapex]

A t25 is a big turbo. If you want that kind of power from a 1.8 liter, high compression motor. Sure it can be done. Tear the motor down rebulid it with beefed up parts, lower the compression. Properly fit the turbo and everything that goes along with it into a very tight package, making sure the I/C is properly coooling it, a fair amount of tuning, run in on race gas. To do it right you'll need to change the tire package & most likely the suspension. So for a lot of time, effort and $$$, your get a car that wickedly fast, if you can even keep it hooked up. With such a big turbo running higher boost there'll be lot of lag to deal with.

My understanding is the t25 is a tiny turbo. It's the size of the turbo that comes on the RX-7 twin turbo. It's roughly the size of a TD05-14b, and smaller than the CT26 that comes on the MR2 turbo. Has this changed?

 

[smoseley]

I'm pretty sure a t25 is a smaller turbo.

BTW, isn't the RX-7 twin-turbo a sequential turbo? If so, is the t25 the smaller or larger of the two?

 

[gotapex]

Yeah, the RX7's 13b was twin sequential turbo'd. However, both turbos were the same size. The "bigger" turbo was simply both turbos working together at the higher rpm. Some people removed the sequential mechanism to have it work as a conventional twin turbo, giving more horsepower and only 1 power lump instead of 2. The t25's could be reworked to slightly higher flowing t28's relatively easily too.

 

[LarryB]

Yeah, the t25 is a smaller turbo, for that kind of hp you'll need to run higher boost. Japan is great place to do a n/a to turbo (Japanese cars/motors). That’s were all kits came from and alot of great turner that know what there doing. Here in the States, it's more up to the individual to know all the fine details of what needs to be done. There has been very little done for the 2zz-ge, throw in the Lotus tuning and how it’s packaged into the Elise, there’s going to be a ton of trail and error trying to see what works best… but if you’ve got deep pockets, patience and willing to deal with lots of down time, void your warranty… it could be fun to see what you can get out of it.

Have own a mid-engine car design for a turbo, guys have mod them to run in the 400-500hp range (stock 200 hp). I can appreciate the work and effort that goes into it. As well as the speed they get out of them. But I’ve always been more interested in the handling. The Elise should be fast enough and a turbo takes a edge off of the handling. If I want a bit more speed will look into dropping weight or getting a bit more out of it in N/A trim.

 

[OneFastLotus]

A t-25 IS a small turbo and spools very fast.

A T-25 is too small to be pushing that kind of flow. I had a T25-28 hybrid (which is a bit bigger) on one of my miatas and it ran out of breath at 240rwhp. Went to a T3/T4 and pushed her up to 350to the wheels.



I had my 3rd gen RX7 wired to hit in parallel for a bit, but just went ahead and removed all of the mess and put on a T-88 single.

 

[LarryB]

With the 2zz-ge it's starting out at 190hp (J-spec), pretty sure the 300hp is crank and not rwhp... do agree it'll have to run towards the limits for those #'s. Along with fair amount of rework for the motor.

edit- forgot the kit is for the 1zz motor which is more like 150hp... so that is pushing a T25 pretty hard.

 

[gotapex]

A t-25 IS a small turbo and spools very fast.

A T-25 is too small to be pushing that kind of flow. I had a T25-28 hybrid (which is a bit bigger) on one of my miatas and it ran out of breath at 240rwhp. Went to a T3/T4 and pushed her up to 350to the wheels.



I had my 3rd gen RX7 wired to hit in parallel for a bit, but just went ahead and removed all of the mess and put on a T-88 single.

Holy smoke! A T88 is like the size of my head.

 

[RacingDynamcs]

t100 is the size of your head the t88 is almost...

 

[OneFastLotus]

the big T-88 is pretty large...I had a T51R which is a T-100+ but it spooled a little slow for my tastes. Had to use nitrous to spool it.

 

[mlk_f1]

edit- forgot the kit is for the 1zz motor which is more like 150hp... so that is pushing a T25 pretty hard.

Yep, they are pushing it real hard. The stock 1ZZ on the MR-S only has 138hp.

 

[Lotus F1]

A t-25 IS a small turbo and spools very fast.

A T-25 is too small to be pushing that kind of flow. I had a T25-28 hybrid (which is a bit bigger) on one of my miatas and it ran out of breath at 240rwhp. Went to a T3/T4 and pushed her up to 350to the wheels.



I had my 3rd gen RX7 wired to hit in parallel for a bit, but just went ahead and removed all of the mess and put on a T-88 single.

Mmmm, I have a T28 in my Miata and have dyno'ed at 270rwhp, that would be about 305bhp as initially mentioned. It can be done on a T28 turbo, as I have. Your 240rwhp is still 275bhp, the reference they are using.

 

[LittleRocket]

The top secret 1zz turbo kit will make 300 h/p for a dyno run or 2 before the engine expires.......

The 2zz isn't boost friendly. It has aluminium cylinder liners and is 11.5:1 compression. 7psi and it will make 270 whp but won't last. Drop the compression, pin the cylinders, sleeve it, stuff it with forged internals and yeah it will take some boost. There is one that reportedly makes 450 h/p in a spyder........ I have a 2zz I am building at the moment to run n/a somewhere near 10k rpm (depending on stock cam flow limitation) and should be around 220-240 crank h/p for my spyder.

I have a ton of pics of the build and will post them up in the near future. The first thing that needs to be done to a Lotus is baffle the silly oil pan. It is only good for 1.0g according to the technical development papers. I have done mine for the spyder transplant later this month and will report the stability of oil pressure here as well as nc.org.

The 2zz and 1zz engines are miles apart. The 1zz engine is a corolla engine mistakenly put into a sports car (spyder). In short the 1zz is crap. I have been through 3 basically stock engines in 90k miles so I am swapping to the 2zz. Beat on the 1zz for a while and it will have problems. The 2zz is a whole different animal with performance in mind. Right down to the water pump.

I have a ton of pics along with some mods (port work etc.) Let me know what you want to see about the engine and I probably have pics or can take them. I am not going into the short block but have the front of the engine and cylinder head apart and the top end ported.

Does anyone have any pics of the Lotus exhaust and intake tube?