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Discussion Starter #1 (Edited)
I am in the process of purchasing some 16X7 front and 17X8 rota wheels, either team dynamics 1.2 or Rota torques for dedicated track usage. It looking for the fastest lap just best bang for my buck.

Looking at Toyo R888
Hoosier A6 or R6
Thinking 205/45/16 front
Thinking 245/4017 rear?

Let me know your thoughts and why.
 

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not really the same class of tires

The toyos are acceptable street tires, in race compound.

either of the hoosiers are dot legal, but not really streetable, past say driving 50 miles to the track. They are more or less "slicks" in disguise. Life is measured in hours not miles.

The hoosiers will have way more grip than the toyos, which in their own right have a great deal more grip than normal street tires
 

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Why not Toyo RA1s? Probably somewhere in between the other 2 as far as grip, but should last longer than the hoosiers and give more consistent laps than the r888s.
 

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Toyo R888 = Best for fast street or auto-x, not very tolerant of track sessions as they get overheated and greasy rather easily/quickly.

Yokohama A048 = Compromise between fast street and tolerant of track days. A tire you can actually drive to and from the track yet still have decent grip.

Hoosier A6 in 205/45-16 & 225/40-17; best option for track-specific tires for naturally aspirated Elise's. The shorter rear tire improves gearing. Higher powered Elise/Exige's benefit from the extra grip of the overall bigger 245/40-17 rear tire. The R6 compound doesn't appear to get up to preferred temps, though YMMV with very high powered Eliges.
 

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Yellotus,
I love my R1Rs too, but I haven't tried them on a track day (I use A6 or R6 depending on the track). I would like to hear from someone if the R1R tires grease up when tracked.
 

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My advise is to work backward. Decide the tires you want to run and then find some wheels that will allow you to run them.
 

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Discussion Starter #8
My advise is to work backward. Decide the tires you want to run and then find some wheels that will allow you to run them.
See my issue is I don't know what size Tires would work, I ran one track day on a set of 6 year old AD07 tires in the 175/195 size and then received a fairly used set of A048 tires in the 195/225(or whatever stock is) size and they were a huge difference so I don't know anything else. All I know is that I can't keep running the A048 tires on the stock 5.5" wide wheels, to much sidewall roll so anything will be an improvement and my funds are fairly limited to $2,200 for a set of wheels and tires, which leaves me $1,000 for tires, $1,000 for wheels and $200 for shipping if needed. That is all the money I have set aside for the car for the rest of the year or I will need to start canceling tack days and i am not doing that :no: lol
 

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HoHos R6s
Make sure you heat cycle them first and let them sit
You will never go back.....
Once you have had 15 heat cycles they will be somewhat dead---just soak them with 50/50 tylene/xylene to bring them back to life for a few more cycles

Yokos better but too much $$$
 

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How many track days have you done? You don't normally see people cross shopping hoosier vs. r888.

Its pretty simple to do a search an find what widths people are running. here's a simple tire calculator so that you can get close to stock wheel/tire heights if you choose to run different width's front or back:

Tire size calculator

For a streetable track tire there's R888, RA1, NT01, A048. There are plenty of places to find wheels to fit whatever tire you choose (sector111, blackwatch, treadzone). If you want slicks or the like, can't help you there. For myself I'm also looking at "bang for buck", I'm planning to run either NT01 or RA-1.
 

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Discussion Starter #11
How many track days have you done? You don't normally see people cross shopping hoosier vs. r888.
I have only done three track days in my Lotus, one on stock tires, two on very used A048 but have years of experience in my Subaru STi, but always with stock tires.

The reason i don't know yet is that i don't want to only get 4 track days on hoosiers for $1,000 if i can get 20 track days on R888 tires for $1,000. I know that I want the hoosiers but what kind of lifespan differences are there? I am trying to find the balance of my budget so that I get the most track time possible but am not sacrificing track time so that I can get better tires but miss out on 4 track days because i don't have tires for the track days.

I have never upgraded tires because I have always been torn between slicks with very limited life but the ultimate cornering experience or fairly good tires that leave something to desire but more time with them.
 

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If you want to get the maximum track days out of *any* tire, you will need to get a fair amount of neg camber dialed in on your suspension. Otherwise, you will wear the edges down to the chords long before the rest of the tire is worn out.
 

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Totally agree with Ryephile.

I had used Hoosier wets but then had 3 sets of wheels to take with me (hassle). I found that I never would get heat into the wets and never really got my value from them. In TT you rarely have a rain out it seems and you never set a faster lap in the rain over dry laps.

So I use Toyo R1R for rain/intermediate/street only and they do well in those situations...they are not a good dry track tire. The tread pattern is squashy, they get to hot - greasy and they just don't hold like a true track tire.

Hoosier A6 is a preferred tire if you have an extra set of wheels or one of the other higher-end tires like yoko slicks but they get expensive real quick as they don't last as long.

I run close to stock power in an s240 and tried using 245 A6 rears and had two issues. One, I lost top speed on average of 7-10 mph and two I would get rubbing on the inside/top under high load even with spacers so that killed cornering speed. With that being said, that is for my setup...others may have better luck but really for my power the 225 rears work great and I just have a little spin out of low speed corners which is very easy to work with.

To put wear in perspective, A6 I get 3 weekends or 30 - 15min. runs out of them before they lose time for me (1 to 2 sec. a lap). You can drive these close to cords so for a club or HPDE driver you will be able to go another weekend or more based on your driving level, so at least 4 weekends of fantastic grip.

A048's I could get 4-5 weekends maybe before being shot but also an additional 1-2k of road miles on them. Math wise you save this route in both tire and wheel purchase but they are not even on the same level as an A6.
 

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Try buying new front R6 Hoosiers due to unique size and get used rears R6's from any of a number of teams for ~50 each. I chewed up a 2 rears in 2 days at NJMP but investment was only $100 and they stuck like glue as they only had ~3-5 heat cycles!
 

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Discussion Starter #15
My Sector111 DSBrace should be coming in the mail tomorrow so I will be getting an alignment and can change to negative camber if needed. I also just ordered a set of Rota Torques in 16X7 and 17X8 so am thinking will stick with 205 front and 225 rear because i am in stock suspension and stock powered Elise. These will be dedicated track wheels so if i can get 5 club/HDPE days out of A6 tires that is still about $200 in tires per day. So far i am on two track days on A048's and have my third(and last on them) this Saturday and those tires were given to me after probably 3-4 track days on my friends two eleven.
 

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Discussion Starter #16
Try buying new front R6 Hoosiers due to unique size and get used rears R6's from any of a number of teams for ~50 each. I chewed up a 2 rears in 2 days at NJMP but investment was only $100 and they stuck like glue as they only had ~3-5 heat cycles!
How do I get ahold of said Teams because two days for $50 and buying fronts is something i am fine with. I obviously do OK with used tires so :shift:
 

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Go on Ebay and search for Tuglu or Playboy cup teams. Those are east Coast options. Find Spec Miata and other SCCA classes that MUST run sticker tires for each race in your area. Lots of BFG R1's out there as well.
 

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Toyo RA-1

If you are looking for bang for your buck, I would strongly suggest you look at a 15/16 inch combo. I run 15x7.0 and 16x8.0 wheels. Toyo makes 205/50-15 and 245/45-16 in the RA1 and they are quite reasonably priced. Plus the compound is very consistent throughout their lifespan, progressive breakaway and won't bite you in the a$$. I think I had about a dozen track days on my set last year averaging 4 run groups each day.

Personally, I'm not a fan of the R888 on the track. I find they are too temp sensitive (get greasy too quickly) and heat cycle out too quickly. I was forced to run R888 when they stopped making the RA1s for awhile and was not impressed.

Keep in mind the 15/16 inch wheels are typically lighter and the tires are typically cheaper as well.

I'm not certain of the sizes of the Nitto NT01 in 16/17 but they are supposedly the same rubber compound as the Toyo RA1. I ran the NT01 one year and they were good as well, just the wrong sizes for the 15/16 wheels.

Edit: Sorry, just re-read the thread and saw you already ordered the wheels. Regardless, I would still consider at least looking at your 15/16 options.
 

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Discussion Starter #19
I ended up going with the Toyo R888 in 195/50/16(I think) in the front and 245/40/17 in the rear. I had a slight fuel issue at The Ridge Motorsports park on a hard sustained left turn and decided to get a few more supporting modifications before going with Hoosiers. It seems like the R888 does not have the longest most consistant performance but I only have 4-5 more track days this year and then will have the fuel issue corrected over the winter and ready for next track season on the Hoosier R/A6 or will upgrade(change) over to the 15/16 combo.
 
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