[Chhirowolf]

I have learned a great deal on the forum from exhaust replacement to oil change. Now I'm ready to steep up to some to something else.

Can or has anyone posted a DIY on Brake or Transmission Fluid change?
Are they using the same reservoir?
How do I bleed the brakes?
Do I need a new transmission fluid filter?

While on brakes. any DIY on pad changes.
Can the rotors by turned

So many questions. This Forum has be a great resource in the past. Now I want to do more. :UK:

I have used the search and many questions have been answered, but the above still linger.

I asked these questions because I want to track my car more. I would like to be able to do these things all myself without having to rely on my dealer or mechanic.

Thanks for such a great place to gather and exchange info :bow:

 

[brgelise]

If you have a track day buddy, it is great to watch and learn or buy them beers to help you deal with the LITTLE things that happen.

1. Buy Speed Bleeders for brakes and clutch. You just made that easy.
2. Pads are quite easy and posted in here somewhere from when I fit the DTC70s.
3. No trans filter on a manual . Drain is easy. Fill not so much as access may be a real treat for filler hose (haven't done it yet on Evora but it was real fun on Elise!
4. No need to turn rotors! track days wear them out. Substrate build up is major source of any pulsing esp on stock pads if you overcook them.

 

[Chhirowolf]

If you have a track day buddy, it is great to watch and learn or buy them beers to help you deal with the LITTLE things that happen.

1. Buy Speed Bleeders for brakes and clutch. You just made that easy.
2. Pads are quite easy and posted in here somewhere from when I fit the DTC70s.
3. No trans filter on a manual . Drain is easy. Fill not so much as access may be a real treat for filler hose (haven't done it yet on Evora but it was real fun on Elise!
4. No need to turn rotors! track days wear them out. Substrate build up is major source of any pulsing esp on stock pads if you overcook them.

Thanks for the info. :up:
Ordering the Speed bleeders this week.
What trans fluid are you recommending?

 

[glb]

Can or has anyone posted a DIY on Brake or Transmission Fluid change?
Are they using the same reservoir?
How do I bleed the brakes?
Do I need a new transmission fluid filter?

While on brakes. any DIY on pad changes.
Can the rotors by turned

I asked these questions because I want to track my car more. I would like to be able to do these things all myself without having to rely on my dealer or mechanic.

Bleeding Brakes:

I don't use, or know about speed bleeders. The following was learned from a Toyota engineer, builder of championship winning cars & bikes.

Do not use a foot. You will push the m/c piston thru the previously unused (and rough) portion of the m/c and shorten the piston seal life.

Sears brake bleed kit, Sears hand vacuum pump.

1. Use correct adapter from kit.
2. Ensure you can open bleed valve.
3. Pump vacuum to about 20-25.
4. Tap caliper with small hammer (releases air bubbles clinging to metal of caliper).
5. Open bleed valve.

Rinse, Repeat.

Cheap, fast and easy. The way I like my wimmin too....

a. Do NOT let reservoir go dry. Air will get into system.
b. Use baster to get most of old b/f out of reservoir.



Brake Pads:

Get a shop manual.
It's usually pretty obvious, but some pistons (as Elise) need to be screwed back into caliper for new pad clearance.
Sorry, don't know Evoras.
Loosen cap of m/c reservoir. Do NOT let that run over as you push/screw pistons back in.



Trans lube:

Again, no Evora knowledge.

FIRST, loose fill plug. If you drain trans (assuming stick) and then can't open fill plug, you are in deep doodoo.

I use a hand pump (looks like grease gun). Suck in some lube, push into trans.

Put some newspaper around.


don't know what you mean by "use the same reservoir". Mean clutch and brakes? No Evora knowledge.

 

[alp]

Chhirowolf,

I actually did a brake/clutch fluid bleed DIY after I posted the exhaust and oil change DIY. Shortly after I sold the car. And I have to admit I was tardy in creating a new thread.

As far as I recall, it's pretty straight forward. No special tools needed. No funny codes or dealer's reset etc. The usual advice would be:

1. Don't over tighten the bleeder valves.
2. Make sure to always check the brake reservoir level.
3. Test drive around the block before you go on a longer trip.

Do it the old fashion (2-person), use Motiv Bleeder or go with brgelise's speed bleeders (I see that you did already).

One thing I will mention though. The clutch bleed valve on my evora was a pita to access. The nipple was facing the firewall and that leaves very little clearance to slip on a tube for bleeding. YMMV.

I went with Motul RBF 600.:up:

 

[glb]

No. Do not use 2 person for reasons already explained.

My method is quicker, easier and results in the hardest pedal my cars ever got.

BTW, I like Castrol LMA. Low Moisture Absorption and high boiling point.

Tech guy for NJ BMW CCA tested older, used b/f and found the LMA to hold up best.

(I do not own stock in Sears or Castrol....)

 

[brgelise]

Seen as you haven't used Speed Bleeders, here is what your mechanic didn't tell you. Moving the master Cylinder thru unused portions is an issue if it hasn't been done for years. On my vehicles for past 10 yrs, I bleed then regularly (due to the ease of Speed Bleeders) and have never had a single issue with brakes< cylinders etc on any of them.
Speed Bleeders are a solo event BTW. Your Pressure Bleeder used to be the best way to go but IMHO not anymore. Don't knock them or speak against them unless you've tried them. Yea, they're that good. Should be OE on all vehicles but the industry has an epidemic problem with corner cutting.
Don't need to take all that "GEAR" to the track. Just 1 wrench is all it takes and alot of racers are now using them because you can bleed a pedal in middle of race in like 15seconds/wheel if you're slow.

 

[glb]

Seen as you haven't used Spped Bleeders, here is what your mechanic didn't tell you. Moving the master Cylinder thru unused portions is an issue if it hasn't been done for years. On my vehicles for past 10 yrs, I bleed then regularly (due to the ease of Speed Bleeders) and have never had a single issue with brakes< cylinders etc on any of them.
Speed Bleeders are a solo event BTW. Your Pressure Bleeder used to be the best way to go but IMHO not anymore. Don't knock them or speak against them unless you've tried them. Yea, they're that good. Should be OE on all vehicles but the industry has an epidemic problem with corner cutting.
Don't need to take all that "GEAR" to the track. Just 1 wrench is all it takes and alot of racers are now using them because you can bleed a pedal in middle of race in like 15seconds/wheel if you're slow.

Oh, he was way more than a mechanic. Big time engineer at GM & Toyota.

His cars & bikes won a lot of races.

That aside, I am glad you experience no issues, but logic dictates that there is no point in that method.

We know, from taking m/cs apart what the less used section of the bore looks like.

Not pretty.

So, no point in promoting premature seal wear.

Also, I wouldn't use a pressure bleeder. I use vacuum.

Gear is not an issue, would fit in a manila env: small vacuum pump, line, small container.

Race cars have rebuilt m/cs more often than street cars. Street cars often go a couple of yrs...or more, right?

After 50 or so years doing brakes, I can again say that the method results in the best pedal.

But, if you're happy, I'm happy.

 

[holmz]

I have learned a great deal on the forum from exhaust replacement to oil change. Now I'm ready to steep up to some to something else.
...

Brakes are important. I do not do my own chiropracty, probably for the same reason why you may want to consider NOT doing your own brakes.

 

[Chhirowolf]

Brakes are important. I do not do my own chiropracty, probably for the same reason why you may want to consider NOT doing your own brakes.

Very true

But..........

I do expect my patients to take a active role in their own healthcare. The body can heal itself in many cases. As a physician I just try to help the body along a bit.
Unfortunately a Lotus does not have that same capacity. I need to be aware and knowledgeable about as much as possible if I expect the car to keep performing.
I have had some pretty poor results from my dealers technician, leaving me with more problems than fixes. Not a lot of trust for that route.
Fluid changes and brake pad replacement is far from rocket science. I think with good direction and a "track buddy", like brgelise suggested, I could handle the tasks.
I take all the auto maintenance task seriously. Not planning on pulling the engine and tranny any time soon, but oil change or exhaust change is well within even the most inexperienced owner.

Just my .02

thanks for everyone input. Please feel free to add to the thread and keep the conversation going. :up:

 

[cashxdr]

Ok, I had never heard of speed bleeders. Looks awesome.

One question, how well do the internals handle heat?

I track my car often and the brakes/calipers get very hot.

 

[Julian73]

The internal is a SS ball seated against a machined V. They have held up in race situations for me and others.

 

[Steve]

Interesting discussion, esp for guys like me who aren't technical or mechanically talented. I agree with Dr. Wolf, I think it's really important not only to understand our cars, but to take an active role in keeping them maintained. For the guys to whom stuff like this is second nature, please be aware that many of us "civilians" find these discussions really valuable, so thanks and please keep it up! Much appreciated

 

[Julian73]

We all do better to learn basics. While I grow up in a car family, I ignored opportunities to learn, then right out of college I purchased a TR-4A as DD and learnt by gun point breaking down on way to work became second nature that you just built into the schedule and learnt to accept and accommodate. Breaking down on interstate in middle of bridge became a memorable experience, where I became like a race team pit crew, jumping out of car, with tools and wire in hand somehow quickly diagnosed problem in ignition system, made up a wire jumper and was running again within minutes. Years before that I would have been flustered, hands in the air flagging down a ride (before cell phones).

 

[brgelise]

Oh, he was way more than a mechanic. Big time engineer at GM & Toyota.

His cars & bikes won a lot of races.

That aside, I am glad you experience no issues, but logic dictates that there is no point in that method.

We know, from taking m/cs apart what the less used section of the bore looks like.

Not pretty.

So, no point in promoting premature seal wear.

Also, I wouldn't use a pressure bleeder. I use vacuum.

Gear is not an issue, would fit in a manila env: small vacuum pump, line, small container.

Race cars have rebuilt m/cs more often than street cars. Street cars often go a couple of yrs...or more, right?

After 50 or so years doing brakes, I can again say that the method results in the best pedal.

But, if you're happy, I'm happy.

So I assume you've tried them but were unimpressed?:shrug: The key here is did you try them??
If you're so concerned about the cylinder bore, stick to half pedal strokes.

 

[brgelise]

Very true

But..........

I do expect my patients to take a active role in their own healthcare. The body can heal itself in many cases. As a physician I just try to help the body along a bit.
Unfortunately a Lotus does not have that same capacity. I need to be aware and knowledgeable about as much as possible if I expect the car to keep performing.
I have had some pretty poor results from my dealers technician, leaving me with more problems than fixes. Not a lot of trust for that route.
Fluid changes and brake pad replacement is far from rocket science. I think with good direction and a "track buddy", like brgelise suggested, I could handle the tasks.
I take all the auto maintenance task seriously. Not planning on pulling the engine and tranny any time soon, but oil change or exhaust change is well within even the most inexperienced owner.

Just my .02

thanks for everyone input. Please feel free to add to the thread and keep the conversation going. :up:

BINGO! The driver should always be the final quality control! Brakes are quite straight forward. They just require good technique for proper service. I love it when someone busts a product they haven't tried but are, at the same time all knowing......I had pressure, vacuum bleeders etc. To me all were a PIA in comparison to the Speed Bleeders and BTW pedal is just as good. 0% chance of backflow.

If I were at the track, I'd gladly walk you thru the process. Again with Speed Bleeders, you just losen niplle push on pad to spread piston back, and remove without ever worrying about air getting in system. On a standard nipple, the classic for getting air in system is slipping off pad or piston while compressing them open,. You just sucked air into the worst place to remove it from, the caliper. The KISS principle is at work with the SB's.

 

[glb]

So I assume you've tried them but were unimpressed?:shrug: The key here is did you try them??
If you're so concerned about the cylinder bore, stick to half pedal strokes.

Yes, the half pedal technique might work.

But, given that we need to tap the calipers to get the clinging air bubbles into the stream, I'll stick with my method.

I tap and immediately bleed.

Again, we all have our preferences....

 

[glb]

We all do better to learn basics. While I grow up in a car family, I ignored opportunities to learn, then right out of college I purchased a TR-4A as DD and learnt by gun point breaking down on way to work became second nature that you just built into the schedule and learnt to accept and accommodate. Breaking down on interstate in middle of bridge became a memorable experience, where I became like a race team pit crew, jumping out of car, with tools and wire in hand somehow quickly diagnosed problem in ignition system, made up a wire jumper and was running again within minutes. Years before that I would have been flustered, hands in the air flagging down a ride (before cell phones).

Yes. Driving crappy British cars taught many of us how to fix things.

Jamie Kitman, a favorite auto writer, refers to his fleet of these cars as "Sport Futility Vehicles".

Check out "By the Time I Get to Oxnard" and a great piece, "My Brave New Face".

 

[Bobsy Racer]

No. Do not use 2 person for reasons already explained.

My method is quicker, easier and results in the hardest pedal my cars ever got.

BTW, I like Castrol LMA. Low Moisture Absorption and high boiling point.

Tech guy for NJ BMW CCA tested older, used b/f and found the LMA to hold up best.

(I do not own stock in Sears or Castrol....)

Castrol LMA is cheap and readily available, BUT is not necessarily the best fluid available. It boils at 446 degrees dry, and 311 wet.
See my chary of Brake Fluids in post 31 here:
http://www.lotustalk.com/forums/f170/evora-high-perf-fluid-swaps-150657/index2.html
I would go for Castrol SRF, or ATE Super Blue/Gold for a high performance street car, even if tracked occasionally.

Regarding Vacuum Bleeding, applying suction to the brake fluid at the caliper can actually suck air past the caliper piston seals. That is why Carroll Smith recommends the old fashion pedal pumping, in "Prepare to Win". BTW, slow pedal strokes with the bleeder open is all that is necessary. You do NOT need to do the pump it up, open, down, close, pump it up again sequence. He also recommends "bleed one front and one rear caliper simultaneously which ensures FULL travel of each master cylinder piston, and precludes the possibility of trapping a bubble in the master cylinder itself".

 

[glb]

Hey, BR

I've heard that theory, but in 15 yrs that has not been my experience.

Good book, huh?