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What's the Best Synthetic Oil for Elise?


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TurnTen said:
"If Texaco/Havoline products are not available, an oil meeting the following specification should be used."

(Spec listed - 5W/40, API SL/CF, SJ/CF; ACEA A3)

I wouldn't be surprised if Texaco paid Lotus a fair amout of money to be named in the manual.
Nothing that sinister. Havoline products are common and apparently well respected in the UK, so it's what Lotus uses/tests/specifies.

Although they do seem to indicate the Havoline coolant, they provide the info to what oil to use instead of the Havoline. Havoline is not necessarily the best oil, but it's what Lotus has used and verified. The fact that it's almost impossible to find here in the US, means that we have to find other oil to use. I used Castrol from my last change (the proper viscosity). I use Mobil 1 in my other cars and would readily use it in the Elise if it was in the proper viscosity and specifications.
 

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Every store I stopped at had Havoline. None had Havoline synthetic. Ended up also going with Mobil 1 OW-40- same thing availability, and a K&N Oil filter (bought on e-bay, same part # as the lotus one but listed for a 96 Ford mini-van, lol) For the money I'll save by doing it myself, I can add an exhaust or nitrous. It really is asanine what the dealer charges. I like doing this sort of thing myself anyway, just so I know it's done right- and can take the time to inspect and familarize myself with the rest of the vehicle while down there. It's good "bonding" lol.
 

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DARBY#33 said:
05elise NM,
What does SME mean and should I be offended? ;)
Subject Matter Expert

Are you offended now?
 

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Thanks...not offended, now educated.

Ok, how about some help on this one?----->:tadts: or TADTS
what do they mean?

I'm clueless on these computer anagrams, hell I still think a Gig is when a band gets a job to play somewhere.
 

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DARBY#33 said:
Thanks...not offended, now educated.

Ok, how about some help on this one?----->:tadts: or TADTS
what do they mean?
Me first, oh, oh, oh, can't wait to educate you, oh boy, oh boy....

They...........All.................Do..................That..................Sir

Ta Da!!!!!!!!!!
 

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DARBY#33 said:
Thanks...not offended, now educated.

Ok, how about some help on this one?----->:tadts: or TADTS
what do they mean?

I'm clueless on these computer anagrams, hell I still think a Gig is when a band gets a job to play somewhere.
That ones not a general computer one - more specific to Lotus. It comes from what the service department says when you tell them you have a noise/problem/concern - They All Do That Sir. As in, "I have they really strange sound coming from the front suspension"; "They All Do That Sir" ...
 

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resurrecting the dead

OK folks 5/40 Mobile 1 Syn oil is no longer made by Mobile (checked the website)

Can I mix redline with the Mobile 1 as I can only get half the oil out?

thanks

Nick
 

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Nick said:
OK folks 5/40 Mobile 1 Syn oil is no longer made by Mobile (checked the website)

Can I mix redline with the Mobile 1 as I can only get half the oil out?

thanks

Nick

they still make one, but they call is turbo diesel synth.
It meets all the same specs.

Mobil claims that the 0-40 would be a good choice when I emailed them, but I would want something from Lotus saying it is ok (warranty and all). I know some do use it.

I'm using the turbo diesel Mobil one in mine.
mark
 

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Nick,
Yes you can mix the two. The Amercian Petroleum Institute mandated that all engine oils must be compatable.
BG Products makes an engine oil flush machine which would flush all of the oil and cleaning solution out of the cooler by blowing air thru the system after the flush was completed. Then a motor oil additive called MOA is injected back into these air blown areas to ensure instant lubrication at start up.
I'll check but I dont think any of the Lotus dealers use this machine. If we all asked our dealerships to get one, we could actually get all of the oil out of our systems instead of just 2/3rds. This is why we flush automatic transmissions cause a "drain and fill" doesn't empty the torque converter. We pay ALOT of money for an oil change at the dealership, if they are leaving oxidized oil in our systems the new oil doesn't last as long and is prime to breakdown and start "sludging" up. If they are going to charge us BIG dollars to change our oil, I want ALL of it changed!
Here is a pic of the machine:
More at www.bgprod.com
 

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The manual is pretty explicit about not expecting the oil coolers to be flushed.

Also, there's a Texaco oil change place near me. Even THEY don't carry the Havoline 5/40 synthetic, but they can order it for me.
 

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FlyLo said:
The manual is pretty explicit about not expecting the oil coolers to be flushed.
Were does it say that? The only reference is on page 100 which states: "On cars fitted with front mounted oil coolers, it is not necessary routinely to attempt to drain the oil cooler circuit"
It is my opinion that this has been written for two reasons the K.I.S.S theory and the fact that Lotus doesnt have a factory (ie, Special Tool) machine to flush engines and coolers with.
When I raced for TRD my local Toyota dealership used a BG engine oil flush machine on my Celica, pretty much the same engine and cooler! Our engine is known to "shear" oil very rapidly in the Toyota world, sheared oil becomes sludge and can block passages and pick up tubes very quickly.
Tribology (the science of lubrication) teaches us that a system with any amount of oxidized fluid will deteriorate the new fluid at an exponential rate. Knowing this, I'm not gonna leave any oxidized oil in my system. But, of course, you can do whatever you want with your car.
 

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DARBY#33 said:
Knowing this, I'm not gonna leave any oxidized oil in my system. But, of course, you can do whatever you want with your car.
The oil capacity of the oil system in the Elise is rather large compared to most cars. You will be changing the oil at least as often as other cars - even if you only change out half (you change more), you are still changing as much oil as you are in other cars. The cooler(s) and extra capacity will greatly help the oil from breaking down as fast as it normally would without them. Synthetic oil will be used that won't "wear out" as fast as regular oil. The life limitation on the oil is not the wear factor, but the contamination factor - the oil gets "dirty" much, much, much faster than it will even begin to wear out.

Flushing the oil cooler/lines is over kill. If not done perfectly, it will induce air in the oiling system, which has the potential to do much more harm than some "old" oil will ever do.

:shrug:

But it's your car, and your money. Feel free to do what you want...
 

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I'm not trying to be argumentative, but I have a simple analogy here:
Jer is sick and has an "accident" in his pants. He strips off his clothes and jumps in to a soothing bath. He washes off his "accident" in the tub. Jer then drains only 2/3rds of the bath water and then refills the tub with hot water. Tim, immediatetly, strips off his clothes and jumps in Jer's tub and actually enjoys it?
If you noticed it doesn't matter how much water was originally in the tub, it is still contaminated with Jer's "accident".
As far as air goes, there is a little air in the oiling system at all times. Case in point, each manufacturer says not to overfill the oiling system so the crank doesn't aereate the oil. When filled properly, there is a space between the crank and the oil level what is in that space? Air. This machine injects a motor oil additive so there isnt a dry start up.
Besides, the man who invented this oil flush machine holds a double doctorate in Chemical Engineering AND Automotive Engineering. He also invented Techron/Techrolene and was in the group whom perfected synthetic motor oil. He is a god in our industry.
I'm sorry that I'm acting like a "know-it-all", I am a Technical Advisor for a automotive lubricant and chemical manufacturer...it's what I do.
Hopefully you guys aren't mad at me.
 

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DARBY#33 said:
As far as air goes, there is a little air in the oiling system at all times. Case in point, each manufacturer says not to overfill the oiling system so the crank doesn't aereate the oil. When filled properly, there is a space between the crank and the oil level what is in that space? Air.
While I agree with you on most of your points, this one I don't. The pressurized oil system shouldn't have air in it. If it does, all sorts of problems can arise. The non-pressurized part (like the sump) certainly will have air above the oil, no problem there.
But you don't want air in the pressurized oil lines. That is why Lotus has a detailed proceedure for bleeding the cooler/lines.

It looks like the flush system will prime the lines from what I can see, but I don't really know that. If it does, than it would be a great choice. At least in my point of view. I would certainly like to get as much of the oil out as possible (although there is no way to get every bit out, unless you completely dismantly the engine)- so you will always have a bit of 'mess' in there.:rolleyes:
 

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Point taken, I was wrong to say that about the air in the non-pressurized side of the system. I think I was busy trying not to vomit over my own analogy.
This machine does prime and inject a lubricant called MOA. Whats left in the system is ounces not quarts. Much more acceptable to me.
Thanks for the correction
 

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DARBY#33 said:
Were does it say that? The only reference is on page 100 which states: "On cars fitted with front mounted oil coolers, it is not necessary routinely to attempt to drain the oil cooler circuit"
It is my opinion that this has been written for two reasons the K.I.S.S theory and the fact that Lotus doesnt have a factory (ie, Special Tool) machine to flush engines and coolers with.
When I raced for TRD my local Toyota dealership used a BG engine oil flush machine on my Celica, pretty much the same engine and cooler! Our engine is known to "shear" oil very rapidly in the Toyota world, sheared oil becomes sludge and can block passages and pick up tubes very quickly.
Tribology (the science of lubrication) teaches us that a system with any amount of oxidized fluid will deteriorate the new fluid at an exponential rate. Knowing this, I'm not gonna leave any oxidized oil in my system. But, of course, you can do whatever you want with your car.
My ZR1 has a rather large oil cooler. Most owners never flush or remove it. I took it ou and drained it. The contents were hideous, the engine had NEW oil in it at the time. There was a 1/8" npt plug in the manifold but no way to access the plug. I fixed that. The velocity thru some coolers can be pretty slow and the junk falls out of suspension and sits in the bottom. My point is that there may be reason to assume that can happen until proven otherwise.
There is likely a satisfactory way to dump and refill the coolers. One first needs to see what type of thermostatic control is there. These things never bang open or shut like solenoids, they open slowly. It's not like all of the sudden 100% of what's in the cooler, be it air or oil, starts flowing. Anyway, this should be looked into further, I believe there's a fair amount of oil that's needs to be drained.
 
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