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61 - 80 of 81 Posts
Discussion starter · #61 ·
Sneaky folks anticipated that and called us after we were quite a few miles down the freeway, asking us to "come back for one last form to sign". Had we pulled the car off the trailer it would have been impossible to get it back on in anything like a reasonable amount of time. After considering all of the possibilities, I'm comfortable that we handled it the best way for this particular situation and combination of sales and home states. As always, YMMV.
 
Discussion starter · #62 ·
This was the TSB for the S1s, but the wrap should be in the same location on the S2s. It's sort of possible to see this from above, but definitely easier if you remove the rear under tray and look at it from below.
I tried to spy it from the top, but no luck. An oil change isn't that far away, I'll confirm it from below then. Thanks again for the TSB!
 
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Sneaky folks anticipated that and called us after we were quite a few miles down the freeway, asking us to "come back for one last form to sign". Had we pulled the car off the trailer it would have been impossible to get it back on in anything like a reasonable amount of time. After considering all of the possibilities, I'm comfortable that we handled it the best way for this particular situation and combination of sales and home states. As always, YMMV.
proper answer was, “fax or scan it to me!” :)

Kevin
 
Discussion starter · #64 ·
I tried that when they called. While strictly speaking they probably couldn't do anything about it, I didn't want to burn the bridge and they made it VERY clear that it was extremely important that they get my signature that day. They even played the "The company president got personally involved and, shall I say, insisted that I stress to you the importance of this document" card. I have a good relationship with the salesman and didn't want to cause trouble for him, so we turned around. He literally met us in the center lane of the boulevard with the paperwork so we didn't even have to manage the truck+trailer in their parking lot... he was standing in the road waiting for us. It was that important to them, and he made it very clear that email/fax wasn't satisfactory to "the higher ups".

It's over now and everything turned out great. I'm even texting back and forth with the salesman AFTER they have my money. A relationship I want to keep very friendly!
 
I tried to spy it from the top, but no luck. An oil change isn't that far away, I'll confirm it from below then. Thanks again for the TSB!
Tried this and found access to the clutch line on my 400 much more restricted than on previous S1; was unable to add additional wrap.......if you find a way to do this without significant R&R of parts please let us know?
 
With a head like yours, do people ever call you square?
"The company president got personally involved and, shall I say, insisted that I stress to you the importance of this document" card. I have a good relationship with the salesman and didn't want to cause trouble for him, so we turned around. He literally met us in the center lane of the boulevard with the paperwork so we didn't even have to manage the truck+trailer in their parking lot... he was standing in the road waiting for us. It was that important to them, and he made it very clear that email/fax wasn't satisfactory to "the higher ups".
With all due respect, recalling you from miles away to meet the the requirement to have a special document unrelated to the transfer of the vehicle signed expressly for the pleasure of the president of Lotus sounds like a pile of steaming offal. No fault of yours of course, but to inconvenience you while towing YOUR car home because he "needs it today" is nothing to insist on if they value your good relationship as much as you value theirs.

A fax or copy received a day or two later or sent from the road (perhaps followed by the original sent by mail) wasn't good enough? Jeebus! Even a formal document required for title transfer could have been dealt with in such matter, never mind something to make the President feel better. No blame falls to you and we are a small family, but that's all the more reason not to ask you to double back when you have many miles to go.
 
Tried this and found access to the clutch line on my 400 much more restricted than on previous S1; was unable to add additional wrap.......if you find a way to do this without significant R&R of parts please let us know?
I've heard the clutch line wrap done at Hethel is made of poor quality ( that's if it was actually done in all vehicles ). The aftermarket clutch line wraps sold online seem to be of better quality.
 
Discussion starter · #69 ·
Can't you get transport tags from your home state to let you bring the car home? They will need the VIN and Bill of Sale, but you should be able to have the plates with you when you go to get it so you can legally drive it home.
As said herein: "That's a great idea - IF your home state issues temporary tags. Idaho does not. Idaho will not issue anything until the actual vehicle is driven to a DMV office and a DMV employee walks out to the parking lot and personally verifies the VIN. Then you get your actual plates on the spot (unless ordering vanity plates)."
 
Props to the OP for this thread. I happened to trailer my Evora S for the first time last week using a U-Haul trailer, so the step-by-step was incredibly helpful.

I second the suggestion of loading the car backwards, which made for a very stable towing experience. In my case, none of the straps came loose, so my own ratchet straps were redundant. I used the 7,500lbs trailer and the tire ratchets were plenty wide enough for the Evora's rear wheels.
 
Guy’s after posting my initial concerns about the O.P’s trailer loading technique and the O.P basically replying with a yea I know BUT type response I realized that this guy wasn’t open to moving off his entrenched position and rather than getting into a pissing contest, I decided to bite my tongue and remain silent; however, reading LE11 post and realizing that people were actually following this advice, I could no longer in good conscious remain silent.

So here’s my disclaimer and I cannot stress this enough; the O.P may have actually been within proper tongue weight parameters, but if in-fact that was the case, it was purely my happenstance! That point is so important, I’ll restate it another way. Loading a mid-engine car backwards on a trailer simply because you “ASSUME” that method displaces the proper weight distribution “MAY”…I stress MAY” actually provide you with the CORRECT tongue weight; but
, you don’t know that until you do the weight calculations. At this point…you are just guessing and the possible consequences are far too great to guess!

Front engine, mid-engine, rear engine, no engine; it doesn’t matter, the “TONGUE WEIGHT” is the determining factor as to how to “PROPERLY” and “SAFELY” load a vehicle on a car hauler trailer “PEROID THE END”! One inch forward or one inch rearward on the trailer could result in adding or subtracting a couple hundred pounds of critical tongue weight on the tow vehicle hitch. The tongue weight “MUST” be between 10 to 15% combined tow weights!

Apparently the O.P had a safe uneventful trip using his own methodology and I could not be happier for him, but despite his C.G contention and pretty picture with a meaningless arrow with no dimensions; the fact of the matter is: “that is not science, it is guess work” pure and simple!

Back in the day your only option to determine proper tongue weight was with the bathroom scale or take the rig to the nearest truck stop, trucking company or scrap yard that had a certified scale. Today I have a “Weigh Safe”(Amazon $300) receiver ball hitch that not only instantly tells me if I’m below/above or with-in the proper tongue weight range, it’s not only easy, but it’s actually fun to use (see attached).

The O.P stated that he is not a towing expert…neither am I; however, I have probably safely loaded several dozen different type vehicles (each presenting its own unique tie down challenge) on car hauler trailers and traveled in excess of 30,000 + + miles over the past 50+ year’s safely and incident free using the tried & proven tongue weight calculation method!

The O.P also stated that he is not an insurance expert…neither am I, but I don’t think you have to be to reasonably conclude that when you flagrantly and willfully disregard U-hauls explicit loading directions (to which the O.P admitted doing); you will be totally libel in the event of an accident. Will your auto insurer cover you? I’m not sure? Possibly if the incident is minor enough your insurance may pick up the tab. What if it’s not so minor, what if that trailer starts swaying out of control into an 83 student school bus which forced into a tanker truck caring a flammable or toxic liquid? At that point I suspect that the Good Hands People will be giving you the finger leaving you out there high and dry!

I apologize if I came across as harsh or disrespectful, that certainly was not my intention, but when safety is involved I tend to get a little exercised.
Jim
P.S While writing this, I couldn’t help but wondering how many people trailing these rental trailers have tow vehicles that are equipped with a trailer brake controller?
 
Discussion starter · #72 ·
As I said: YMMV, standard disclaimers apply, etc.

But in the context of a U-Haul trailer, those using one should consider the following: U-Haul's recommendation for loading the vehicle forward is based on their (openly stated) presumption that this puts the weight of the engine on the front end of the trailer. If you're towing a vehicle whose weight distribution is the opposite of that presumption, does that presumption still apply? Based on your own comments here, which is more important: That the towed vehicle be loaded forward, or that the weight of the towed vehicle be where it should be?

In my judgement, the loading direction is secondary to the weight distribution. Why? Precisely because I agree with you that tongue weight is important. In my humble opinion, anyone who would load a rear-heavy car forward when the instructions clearly state that they intend for the weight to be forward is not compensating for their specific situation. But, as always, each must do what they deem best for their own situation.

While writing this, I couldn’t help but wondering how many people trailing these rental trailers have tow vehicles that are equipped with a trailer brake controller?
That's a non sequiter in this context. The U-Haul trailers have hydraulic surge brakes which are not controllable by a brake controller on the towing vehicle. The connector on the trailer is a 4-flat, with no brake connection. This is clearly documented on their website and proved true in real life, too. Having a brake controller in the towing vehicle makes zero difference with a U-Haul trailer.
 
Thanks to @IDEngineer's experience I was confident to go out and rent a uhaul trailer for my track day today. We opted for pulling it on directly and had no issues with towing or the built in tire straps coming undone. We also put on crossed rear tire straps with these straps: https://www.amazon.com/gp/product/B00A7YJ59G/ which were nice.

I needed at least 2"s of lift under the front wheels to clear the splitter. Used some wood blocks under the ramps and getting up onto the trailer was easy enough, getting on top of the blocks at front was rather difficult the second time around after we wrapped up for whatever reason. We just pushed the car off the trailer and had no issues off loading.

Probably would use the uhaul again sometime but probably gonna look at getting my own trailer as well just so that there is less hassle around this front lip.

1272949
 
Discussion starter · #74 ·
Nicely done! Glad to see there's no problem loading the car either direction. The angle is extreme but it looks like the COG of your car is pretty much right where I estimated in my annotated photo - right over the dual axles.

For those of us who don't envision towing regularly, and thus can't justify the purchase of a dedicated trailer, the U-Haul approach is pretty workable. Thanks for sharing your results!
 
Guy’s after posting my initial concerns about the O.P’s trailer loading technique and the O.P basically replying with a yea I know BUT type response I realized that this guy wasn’t open to moving off his entrenched position and rather than getting into a pissing contest, I decided to bite my tongue and remain silent; however, reading LE11 post and realizing that people were actually following this advice, I could no longer in good conscious remain silent.

So here’s my disclaimer and I cannot stress this enough; the O.P may have actually been within proper tongue weight parameters, but if in-fact that was the case, it was purely my happenstance! That point is so important, I’ll restate it another way. Loading a mid-engine car backwards on a trailer simply because you “ASSUME” that method displaces the proper weight distribution “MAY”…I stress MAY” actually provide you with the CORRECT tongue weight; but View attachment 1267528 View attachment 1267529 View attachment 1267530 , you don’t know that until you do the weight calculations. At this point…you are just guessing and the possible consequences are far too great to guess!

Front engine, mid-engine, rear engine, no engine; it doesn’t matter, the “TONGUE WEIGHT” is the determining factor as to how to “PROPERLY” and “SAFELY” load a vehicle on a car hauler trailer “PEROID THE END”! One inch forward or one inch rearward on the trailer could result in adding or subtracting a couple hundred pounds of critical tongue weight on the tow vehicle hitch. The tongue weight “MUST” be between 10 to 15% combined tow weights!

Apparently the O.P had a safe uneventful trip using his own methodology and I could not be happier for him, but despite his C.G contention and pretty picture with a meaningless arrow with no dimensions; the fact of the matter is: “that is not science, it is guess work” pure and simple!

Back in the day your only option to determine proper tongue weight was with the bathroom scale or take the rig to the nearest truck stop, trucking company or scrap yard that had a certified scale. Today I have a “Weigh Safe”(Amazon $300) receiver ball hitch that not only instantly tells me if I’m below/above or with-in the proper tongue weight range, it’s not only easy, but it’s actually fun to use (see attached).

The O.P stated that he is not a towing expert…neither am I; however, I have probably safely loaded several dozen different type vehicles (each presenting its own unique tie down challenge) on car hauler trailers and traveled in excess of 30,000 + + miles over the past 50+ year’s safely and incident free using the tried & proven tongue weight calculation method!

The O.P also stated that he is not an insurance expert…neither am I, but I don’t think you have to be to reasonably conclude that when you flagrantly and willfully disregard U-hauls explicit loading directions (to which the O.P admitted doing); you will be totally libel in the event of an accident. Will your auto insurer cover you? I’m not sure? Possibly if the incident is minor enough your insurance may pick up the tab. What if it’s not so minor, what if that trailer starts swaying out of control into an 83 student school bus which forced into a tanker truck caring a flammable or toxic liquid? At that point I suspect that the Good Hands People will be giving you the finger leaving you out there high and dry!

I apologize if I came across as harsh or disrespectful, that certainly was not my intention, but when safety is involved I tend to get a little exercised.
Jim
P.S While writing this, I couldn’t help but wondering how many people trailing these rental trailers have tow vehicles that are equipped with a trailer brake controller?
I have my own trailer and have calculated and marked wheel position for the 4 different cars that I trailer ,2 mid engine Lotus and 2 front/mid engine RX-7's. While if in a hurry and but a few miles to two I will load my Evora on frontwards my ideal tongue weight can only be achieved by backing the car on, as forward movement is limited by teh wind screen. The Op did not just wing it by guessing, but as is typical of an engineer sighted lever arm of car vs tongue lever. I myself may a loading spreadsheet for mine, including lever arms of storage boxes, tire rack and fuel storage. Plus anyone that thinks a u-haul trailer is only 1000 lbs must be smoking something as even my all aluminum trailer weights more than that. I mention trailer weight estimate as that is largely centered near the wheel base center, this cars shift forward must be magnified.
 
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This was the TSB for the S1s, but the wrap should be in the same location on the S2s.

It's sort of possible to see this from above, but definitely easier if you remove the rear under tray and look at it from below.
All 4xx's should have the lines wrapped, but you never know and the covering could be better. Regardless rather than fighting the spilt heat shield tubing with adhesive strip, may I suggest using the hoop & loop (i.e velcro type) closure tubing. try 3/8 or 1/2 " diameter.

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Length (in):36.000 in.
Length (ft):3.00 ft.
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I have my own trailer and have calculated and marked wheel position for the 4 different cars that I trailer ,2 mid engine Lotus and 2 front/mid engine RX-7's. While if in a hurry and but a few miles to two I will load my Evora on frontwards my ideal tongue weight can only be achieved by backing the car on, as forward movement is limited by teh wind screen. The Op did not just wing it by guessing, but as is typical of an engineer sighted lever arm of car vs tongue lever. I myself may a loading spreadsheet for mine, including lever arms of storage boxes, tire rack and fuel storage. Plus anyone that thinks a u-haul trailer is only 1000 lbs must be smoking something as even my all aluminum trailer weights more than that. I mention trailer weight estimate as that is largely centered near the wheel base center, this cars shift forward must be magnified.
Julian, I agree, pre-position marking the trailer is a great time saving loading idea; now days I'm only towing one vehicle so after calculating the proper tongue weight, I marked the front wheel point by mounting a 2"x2" piece of aluminum angle stock on an angle, thus also acting as front wheel stop...a real no guess work time saver!

Jim
 
Back on the uhaul to get to the shop for a new drive belt and oil pan. This time I used some more wood

Used 3 10" x 2" x 12' boards.
2 Cut off 19" and placed in the front wheel area.
Then cut a 45Ëš angle at one end.

Then cut the 3rd board down into 4 18" cuts with 45Ëš angle at the end for under the ramps.

I also used the trailer jack to push the trailer up a little bit more.

And then driving the car on was a breeze and no bumps and scraps.

In the future I might pick up 2 more boards to fill the trailer space a a bit more and not have to balance on the 10" area.

1277977

1277978

1277979
 
Friss, you’re use of lumber looks like a nice safe solution to safely loading “nose first” and congratulations on “cross strapping” the rear….looks like you did your homework!
I’m interested in hearing the story behind the drive belt and oil pan…would you please share?
Thanks,
Jim
 
Friss, you’re use of lumber looks like a nice safe solution to safely loading “nose first” and congratulations on “cross strapping” the rear….looks like you did your homework!
I’m interested in hearing the story behind the drive belt and oil pan…would you please share?
Thanks,
Jim
When I bought the car the auxiliary drive belt was squeaking when cold and would go away once the car warmed up (or with a squirt of water) so I finally got around to scheduling swapping in a new belt. The belt is also on the schedule to be replaced every 4 years or 20k(?) miles so it was also due for that based on time anyway. MonkeyWrenchRacing also now has the "gatorback" belt in stock for the 400/GT cars. Lotus OEM Accessory Belt - Evora 400, 400+, GT

The car also came with a Moroso baffled oil pan so figured I'd get that installed as well. From my understanding the GT Cars now come with a baffled pan stock. It just feels like a good upgrade for a track car. MWR Moroso Oil Pan - Lotus Evora, Toyota 2GR-FE V6
 
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