[brgelise]

I think the Evora GT's will be rarer, but considering the Evora is 10+ years older, it will be nowhere near rare as an Emira. Especially when you consider this is supposed to be a short run until they move on to EV's. I would think the V6 Emira's would be the rarest, unless you want to count the AMG engine rarer since it'll be the only non Toyota & with a DCT Lotus.

Not going that way. I predict the number of Emira made will end up being far greater. There was never a deposit/waitlist for Evora. Folks didn't get it. Emira, being so beautiful, has garnered a completely different population of drivers that will experience Lotus for the first time...and get it!!!

 

[Strmshdow84]

Not going that way. I predict the number of Emira made will end up being far greater. There was never a deposit/waitlist for Evora. Folks didn't get it. Emira, being so beautiful, has garnered a completely different population of drivers that will experience Lotus for the first time...and get it!!!

I don't see how that's possible. The Evora had what, a 12 year run? The Emira is supposed to be a stop gap until they go fully EV. I think the predicted run is like 5-6 years if not less, and the V6 is supposed to be even shorter. Somewhere around 2-3 years tops?

 

[jmn444]

wiki says 6,117 total evoras produced, and lotus (i've read) built over 2700 emiras by june of 2023... seems likely they will end up building more overall. that was kinda the entire point I think.

anyone have more current numbers?

 

[Strmshdow84]

If those numbers are true, I can definitely see what was said being true then. The wildcard would be the production number of the V6 models then.

At the same time I feel that the 4cyl might hold it's value pretty well considering the trans. Probably depends more on the overall reliability of the engine/trans.

 

[SirSoysauce]

If those numbers are true, I can definitely see what was said being true then. The wildcard would be the production number of the V6 models then.

At the same time I feel that the 4cyl might hold it's value pretty well considering the trans. Probably depends more on the overall reliability of the engine/trans.

Speculation that an S and R variants are coming for the AMG definitely also seem to be floating around and show promise if they come true. Disappointing, it seems likely that the AMG engine would outproduce the V6 manual due to how regulations are moving right now.

 

[Strmshdow84]

Hopefully they do one last hurrah to let the V6 go out with a bang. Doubtful, but it would be nice.

 

[PRMD]

wiki says 6,117 total evoras produced, and lotus (i've read) built over 2700 emiras by june of 2023... seems likely they will end up building more overall. that was kinda the entire point I think.

anyone have more current numbers?

Evora GT production numbers were 755 last I saw, it's around 1000 for S2 overall in the US when you include the 400. ~6117 is the global total across all Evora. In the first six months of 2023, Lotus:

• Produced over 2,200 Emiras in its UK sportscar manufacturing facility, which is a 381 percent increase from FY22. The order book for Emira is full for the next two years.

For all of 2023:
Lotus has reported a net loss of £594 million (about $751 million USD) for 2023. However the company actually had a good sales year, moving 6,970 vehicles in a twelve-month period. Lotus noted that sales ramped up in the final quarter of 2023, with the company seeing a 110-percent increase after the launch of the Lotus Eletre SUV.
They do break down this number, noting 2609 delivered Emiras in FY 2023. Who knew they build more Eletres than Emiras? Go figure.

So best guess there are probably around 4,000 Emiras running around right now. They should have built over 4,000 last year and presumably many of those were bottled up by the American regulatory problems. It seems plausible the Emira run will exceed the full Evora count by the end of this year.

 

[NC25T]

As someone said before, a GT vs an Emira is not a apples to apples comparison. Emira vs a 400 should be more comparable.

Maybe the higher trims if they make them will compare better with a GT.

I don’t understand why it’s not an apples to apples comparison. Taking the latest evora vs the only version of the Emira presently available seems like a good comparison to me. There were numerous people (including myself) who considered a GT & Emira. I also considered the 400 however I preferred the updates on the GT. I test drove a 400 which had a sticker of $130k, my GT was $112k….. thus I don’t understand why some feel the GT & Emira shouldn’t be compared. Heck you even get suspension options on the Emira which has never been a option here in the states on the Evora.

I made the post due to someone comparing a GT to his evora S as well as a Emira and quoting weight numbers which do not align with what I found when my GT was on the scales.

I am also fully confident that I couldn’t tell the difference when 100-150 lbs is added to my car on the street, I am still going to drop some weight (both my car and myself)

 

[bboixtc]

Evora GT production numbers were 755 last I saw, it's around 1000 for S2 overall in the US when you include the 400. ~6117 is the global total across all Evora.

My count on FB based on everyone's certificate of provenance including mine so far:

759 Evora GTs made so far for North America until someone in Mexico can confirm no Evora GT's were made for that market. (edited post) Pfa

The count so far:

259 2020 (USA) (MT)
115 2020 (USA) (AT)
15 2020 (Canada)
276 2021 (USA) (MT)
72 2021 (USA) (AT)
22 2021 (Canada) (All MT)

 

[lotusquacious]

I saw 3,258 lbs for a Emira with 3/4 tank of fuel, my GT weighed 3,160 with a full tank So probably 100-125 lbs difference between the cars, not the 50# you suggest.

This also makes the GT lighter then the S

personally, I would expect the evora GT430 to be faster then the Emira, I would expect Emira with sport suspension would be quicker then a GT, I would expect touring to be slower…..

My 400 is 3111 lbs (with not quite full tank, call it 3/4) but has been treated to a factory carbon hatch and Antigravity battery and third cat delete. That would put the stock weight of a typical 400 (adding those gains back in) at about 3170 lbs. That weight (3160) for a GT makes sense to me as they and the 400 are so similar. Not factored regarding performance in this comparison is my KT tune which makes an outsized difference but that's not kosher for comparison's sake either. I would nonetheless expect a stock 400 to show just a bit of ankle to an Emira and the GT to do slightly better yet again.

The Emira's stock tunes while perhaps understandable as a function of legislation are still a little disappointing. In compensation the Emira's tune is benefited by not having a clutch switch and having improved on the rev hang situation if I understand it. But that doesn't factor in a straight line pull.

I assume the bulk of the added weight is in the electric seats which isn't a feature I need on any car including my daily. Unfortunately, it's all but a foregone conclusion that any car Lotus builds and 99% of all others going forward will have power seats. Porsche, Honda (and possibly Mazda) will probably be the last major brands standing where you can still get manual seats in their performance products.

Of course, nobody buys an Emira or an Evora for that matter to shine on a drag strip. They're all fast enough to plenty enjoy on the street but going by the features, benefits and brand signature, a more Lotus Emira would not have gained weight or prioritized power seats. The Emira has broadened the appeal of the Evoras and provided a last hurrah for the legacy, last true Lotus platform that forms the basis of all late model Lotus. It's not truly Chapman Lotus and not really future Lotus either. It's Lotus enough. They really need to make an enthusiast one, maybe it shouldn't be an S or a GT. Maybe it should be a T.

I still want one but I have to buy a new daily first to replace my ancient, beloved GTI. I'm seriously considering a C8 since I have a pleasant truck for hauling so I don't need additional practical. I don't need a Z06 but there are plenty of other interesting Vettes to look at. Nice as the Emira is, as a daily a Corvette will be a lot easier, cheaper, and I would even consider buying used,, There are plenty. There's a traditional Lotus feature, at least in my case. Don't use daily.

 

[Strmshdow84]

I don’t understand why it’s not an apples to apples comparison. Taking the latest evora vs the only version of the Emira presently available seems like a good comparison to me. There were numerous people (including myself) who considered a GT & Emira. I also considered the 400 however I preferred the updates on the GT. I test drove a 400 which had a sticker of $130k, my GT was $112k….. thus I don’t understand why some feel the GT & Emira shouldn’t be compared. Heck you even get suspension options on the Emira which has never been a option here in the states on the Evora.

I made the post due to someone comparing a GT to his evora S as well as a Emira and quoting weight numbers which do not align with what I found when my GT was on the scales.

I am also fully confident that I couldn’t tell the difference when 100-150 lbs is added to my car on the street, I am still going to drop some weight (both my car and myself)

I say that it shouldn't be compared to the GT from more of an equipment standpoint. As the GT had a lot of carbon goodies and a HP bump, while I believe the stock 400 didn't receive that treatment. Therefore it makes sense to compare a 400 to a Emira based from an equipment and hp standpoint.

If an Emira with an upgraded spec equipped with carbon parts and a HP bump is released than I think the comparison is more realistic, when talking about weight gain between the 2 models. Realistically the Emira is just the next generation of the Evora, at least to me.

 

[jmn444]

I say that it shouldn't be compared to the GT from more of an equipment standpoint. As the GT had a lot of carbon goodies and a HP bump, while I believe the stock 400 didn't receive that treatment. Therefore it makes sense to compare a 400 to a Emira based from an equipment and hp standpoint.

If an Emira with an upgraded spec equipped with carbon parts and a HP bump is released than I think the comparison is more realistic, when talking about weight gain between the 2 models. Realistically the Emira is just the next generation of the Evora, at least to me.

curious, can you reference any other make/model that the "new" model in the same trim level is lower performance/spec than the outgoing model? a 2024 or whatever emira IS the base model same as a non carbon '21 GT is the base model, right?

 

[Strmshdow84]

curious, can you reference any other make/model that the "new" model in the same trim level is lower performance/spec than the outgoing model? a 2024 or whatever emira IS the base model same as a non carbon '21 GT is the base model, right?

I mean, I don't see why that matters here. These are basically the same cars, and Lotus did what they decided to do. I'm pretty sure most people myself included would've they rather went with more performance than the car currently has. All I'm referencing to is that "I" would think a 400 would be a better base to compare with the Emira, considering their similar HP ratings than a GT, which I mistakenly thought came with more track goodies and has an extra HP bump over the Emira.

 

[jmn444]

yeah, i get your position, that's just akin to saying it'd be cool if a 2025 mustang gt now came with 225 hp because a 1992 gt had 225 and that's what we should compare it to because it's similar.

IMO the outgoing model sets the bar, can't go back in time to find comparables to make the new version sound better. I liked the emira, had a deposit down, this isn't just hating on it, everything is a compromise so I get why they did what they did, but every sports car that I can think of off hand gets faster/better every generation, but I'd be surprised if that's the case here. same driver and same tires and I bet the evora gt comes out on top, even if just marginally.

 

[Strmshdow84]

yeah, i get your position, that's just akin to saying it'd be cool if a 2025 mustang gt now came with 225 hp because a 1992 gt had 225 and that's what we should compare it to because it's similar.

IMO the outgoing model sets the bar, can't go back in time to find comparables to make the new version sound better. I liked the emira, had a deposit down, this isn't just hating on it, everything is a compromise so I get why they did what they did, but every sports car that I can think of off hand gets faster/better every generation, but I'd be surprised if that's the case here. same driver and same tires and I bet the evora gt comes out on top, even if just marginally.

But that wasn't the point of my post. It was more of a let's see how much "weight" was actually added to the Emira. Which when compared to what would be it's closest configuration to the previous models would be a 400. Now if the GT has no weight loss additions and just the HP bump, then by all means compare away. On that front, I think the difference can be explained from the larger rims and the heavy seats. They seem like they didn't really add much in the way of weight.

Now when it comes to performance, why wouldn't you want to test a 400 to a Emira? Again, unless I'm wrong there's not much change between the higher end models other than some track goodies and the HP bump. I think we could better see if the car got better from a handling point of view than the GT just using it's extra HP to power through laps. I think with a tune to bring an Emira to GT power levels, it'll be slightly faster just from the traction gain from it's wider track.

I never bought an Evora although I like them, was very disappointed in the lack of "advancement" in the Emira. But at the end of the day we're basically comparing an updated generation of the Evora. It's like the S550 mustang to the S650, except obviously Ford did like most manufacturers and gave it a power bump.

 

[PRMD]

SavageGeese weighed their test Evora GT, which was a manual non carbon pack, so we have a good full wet weight for that car:

Unfortunately they did not put the Emira on their scales. This guy did put his Emira on scales, with 3/4 of a tank:

His car comes in at 3,248 lbs. So roundabout the ballpark of a hundred pounds appears to be the on-road weight difference in like for like configurations. Carbon pack will take around 49 more pounds off the Evora GT. Interesting to note that the extra weight appears to sit entirely on the rear wheels. The Evora GT and 911 both have a 61% rear weight bias - the Emira sits at 63%.

(I checked and C&D shows the Emira at 3279 lbs. This difference is the equivalent of 5 gallons of gas, so it's a very close agreement to YouTube guy.)

 

[Strmshdow84]

I wonder what fuel differences are. But both weights are pretty comparable to what google says as well GT at 3175 vs the Emira at 3212. To me Lotus did a pretty good job of keeping the weight down while making it more livable. Just wish they would've done more in the powerplant area.

 

[bboixtc]

SavageGeese weighed their test Evora GT, which was a manual non carbon pack, so we have a good full wet weight for that car:
View attachment 1365539
Unfortunately they did not put the Emira on their scales. This guy did put his Emira on scales, with 3/4 of a tank:

View attachment 1365541

His car comes in at 3,248 lbs. So roundabout the ballpark of a hundred pounds appears to be the on-road weight difference in like for like configurations. Carbon pack will take around 70 more pounds off the Evora GT. Interesting to note that the extra weight appears to sit entirely on the rear wheels. The Evora GT and 911 both have a 61% rear weight bias - the Emira sits at 63%.

(I checked and C&D shows the Emira at 3279 lbs. This difference is the equivalent of 5 gallons of gas, so it's a very close agreement to YouTube guy.)

I'm not quite sure how a carbon pack would shave off 70lbs off the GT. The weight is all in the rear glass, hatch, wing, struts and brackets. The roof and front access panel is less than 5lbs difference. Maybe the 70lbs figure is also including a lithium battery and titanium exhaust?

 

[SirSoysauce]

yeah, i get your position, that's just akin to saying it'd be cool if a 2025 mustang gt now came with 225 hp because a 1992 gt had 225 and that's what we should compare it to because it's similar.

IMO the outgoing model sets the bar, can't go back in time to find comparables to make the new version sound better. I liked the emira, had a deposit down, this isn't just hating on it, everything is a compromise so I get why they did what they did, but every sports car that I can think of off hand gets faster/better every generation, but I'd be surprised if that's the case here. same driver and same tires and I bet the evora gt comes out on top, even if just marginally.

I would like to counter argue that there were improvements however, they did not focus on the performance department (which could be considered a problem since its a Lotus). With the Emira, comes a new design, with separate body panels meaning cheaper and easier repairs. Additionally, because many of the interior components are from Geely, we have common parts meaning cheaper replacement parts and a more "together" interior. One could argue, that these are the rather unimportant features that were changed, however, this is exactly what I and many others find really appealing about the car.

Edited: Grammar and punctuation

 

[jmn444]

Well, when I said faster/better, I meant in performance metrics, but yes the emira has some improvements. They 100% changed things to gain market/sales.