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Emira V6 vs I4 on Harry's

19K views 54 replies 24 participants last post by  VV00RA  
#1 · (Edited)
#2 ·
I anticipate the i4 variant will end up being more popular to tune and potentially a more exciting platform for higher power builds if the powertrain and transmission can handle more torque output. As softened as it is from factory, it seems barely behind the V6 in performance, which is what I'm mainly noticing.

I'd pick the manual V6 myself, but that's because I already have my Alfa Romeo 4C which already does what i4 Emira does and it's lighter.
 
#4 · (Edited)
Sound is good for the i4, I think it sounds distinctly different than the AMG cars which is a good thing. Not as great as the V6 but its a good alternative. Figured it would feel a bit lighter, lower center of mass (although sounds like it isn't that noticeable) and a better daily driver/only car.

Reading some other publications they do mention the steering is notably lighter than the V6 hydraulic rack, so was surprised there wasn't more said there.

I think this will be a nice 2nd hand car to look at down the road once issues are resolved with the software. Also think there will be a nice aftermarket for somepaddle shifters!

For my money, would stick with the V6. Biggest issue is still the price point and the fact other cars exist. Was hoping with Geely money the initial pricing would not have increased as greatly as it did until they started producing multiple models with volume. Its just priced out of the market. Doesn't give me a lot of reason to part with anything in the current fleet or to add to the fleet. Second hand a few years ago, we will see.
 
#5 ·
I’m curious to see what more reviewers say, but honestly Harry was always going to be one of their friendliest reviewers and the review should have been glowing. It wasn’t. It sounded for all the world like the I4 is an exercise in adequacy and that bodes very poorly for them as a company at a time that they need to execute.

I would have a hell of a time explaining to someone how this car is worth the extra money over a Cayman S PDK even after the ridiculous Porsche option prices. Matt Farah/Smoking Tire review should be up tomorrow and I suspect he will also try his best to let them down gently.
 
#6 ·
I’m curious to see what more reviewers say, but honestly Harry was always going to be one of their friendliest reviewers and the review should have been glowing. It wasn’t. It sounded for all the world like the I4 is an exercise in adequacy and that bodes very poorly for them as a company at a time that they need to execute.

I would have a hell of a time explaining to someone how this car is worth the extra money over a Cayman S PDK even after the ridiculous Porsche option prices. Matt Farah/Smoking Tire review should be up tomorrow and I suspect he will also try his best to let them down gently.
Agreed. Harry is as pro Lotus as they come (and rightly so), and this review was tepid at best. I don't see the I4 being much of an offer, especially at this price level.
 
#10 ·
Lotus is trying to do too much with 1 car in my opinion. I think it has more to do with trying to rush product to market with engineering they know (V6 manual and IPS) vs what they intended to develop and deliver through end of product cycle with the AMG. In my head, the only way this whole thing should have played out is a re-imagined Exige slightly wider/better interior just a bit more livable space with the v6 powertrain and then released the larger Emira as AMG/DCT only offering.

But yeah to have a vision of a driver centric car and then deliver these test vehicles with sub-par software design is very disappointing on its own. To think they have future plan where a manual doesn't exist is also sad and death of the brand for me.

Lotus can't get out of its own way even with a large influx of cash from China Daddy.
 
#11 ·
The V6 will serve as the preferred choice for manual transmission enthusiasts, but I have a hunch that the i4 DCT will offer better performance for those seeking enhanced driving experiences. There's a considerable amount more potential with the AMG version of the i4, whereas the V6 appears to have reached its performance peak. I'm pretty sure we will see 430hp with the Emira S and (maybe… just maybe) 445-450 with the Emira R. On the other hand, the i4 could readily achieve a reliable 500+ with a simple tuning. People will argue that power isn't everything and that the car is not designed for straight-line speed, it grants potential buyers the opportunity to unleash its capabilities if they so choose.
 
#13 ·
That’s disappointing to hear that the shifts are delayed in the DCT, that’s kind of the whole point of the trade off from a manual IMO.

Given lotus’ track record for not covering warranty work, those thinking of an ECU flash will be in for a rude awakening. Also given the mid-engine layout I wonder how much headroom is left on the table once heat comes into the equation. In Harry’s video I noticed the temp probe right above the turbo, and remembered the lotus guru’s video on why they decided against a turbo engine, with heat concerns in mind, for the Evora. It will be interesting to see what tuners can squeeze out vs what might be required to make consistent power on track.

I guess time will tell, but lotus can’t afford to drop the ball on the driving bits when we all know they will do that in after sale support vs competitors like Porsche.
 
#14 ·
I'm still confused on limiting the I4 to 360hp, most likely so that it would not outshine the V6. But the differentiator is already the V6 sound and manual transmission. Lotus dropped the ball by not putting the I4 at 400hp, and the V6 at 420.

One other gripe. Lotus significantly increases the vehicle price, and can't spend $100 on a more attractive engine cover for the I4? C'mon.
 
#16 ·
If the Chinese market (that is only getting the i4) is getting a 400bhp tuned variant, I do agree that they are short chaining everyone else. The choice should really be between a V6/Manual and a i4/DCT.

Watching some of these other videos you can clearly see 500-1000rpm lags in gear shifts and the visible lag in the display/revs its kind of crazy they would release this to any reviewer or customer. Hell I think the IPS shifts up and down faster than what I am seeing in these videos.
 
#17 ·
The reviews so far seem underwhelming unfortunately for the I4

and at the asking price of 81k GBP that’s a tough sale
Lotus originally proudly told the world it would be under 60k GBP !!

forking out 81k for a 4 pot with a DCT that seems to be far from polished and a uneventful engine note seems a bit nuts to me
 
#19 ·
Yeah it was the price figure for the base model, not the FE. I assume since the FE got a price hike that same price hike will scaled to the Base price as well. Just goes back to where they kind of priced the car attractively at release, that same pricing today would still be competitive in market but now current price takes them back to where they were with Evora pricing and the challenge you have there when other cars exist.

Lotus still has objectively a styling advantage, and suspension/feel advantage. Perceived quality, Dealer network support, and all the issues that come with a lower volume manufacturer start to really go against them.
 
#20 ·
I wonder how resale will be on the i4 models after warranty runs out. Mercedes loses value like a giant stone due to how expensive those engines and transmissions are to repair / replace once they grenade.

I hope Lotus did a good job negotiating warranty repairs on the engines during the period or they may once again go on the brink of bankruptcy with or without Geely
 
#23 ·
I wonder how resale will be on the i4 models after warranty runs out. Mercedes loses value like a giant stone due to how expensive those engines and transmissions are to repair / replace once they grenade.

I hope Lotus did a good job negotiating warranty repairs on the engines during the period or they may once again go on the brink of bankruptcy with or without Geely
Let's not bring up warranty... I just assume a Lotus doesn't have a warranty given their spotty dealer network and the hassle some may have taking it to a dealer. So going into the purchase I have to assume that I will be fixing everything. I think what concerns me most is anything on these new cars that will require software updates in the near term, probably more reason to hold off purchase until they have been on the road a few years and a lot of the issues are ironed out if you don't live in a major metropolitan with access to a Lotus dealer.

They already don't have a competitive warranty compared to other makes in that price bracket. I think warranty/powertrain is still only 3 years/unlimited miles, compared to 4 years/50k for say Porsche or Mercedes. In addition, Porsche has a great in-house extended warranty option (as do other manufacturers) that you just won't get with an aftermarket warranty. (again if Warranty is important to you)
 
#25 ·
Let's not bring up warranty... I just assume a Lotus doesn't have a warranty given their spotty dealer network and the hassle some may have taking it to a dealer. So going into the purchase I have to assume that I will be fixing everything. I think what concerns me most is anything on these new cars that will require software updates in the near term, probably more reason to hold off purchase until they have been on the road a few years and a lot of the issues are ironed out if you don't live in a major metropolitan with access to a Lotus dealer.

They already don't have a competitive warranty compared to other makes in that price bracket. I think warranty/powertrain is still only 3 years/unlimited miles, compared to 4 years/50k for say Porsche or Mercedes. In addition, Porsche has a great in-house extended warranty option (as do other manufacturers) that you just won't get with an aftermarket warranty. (again if Warranty is important to you)
Dealers can make or break a warranty as well. I was just reading last night about a Macan owner with bad wheel bearing that Porsche won't repair under warranty even though he bought it CPO. They said nvl not covered. Even after it went up the chain of command not covered yet I've read of cars getting items covered by warranty by dealer even when out of warranty. With so few Lotus Dealers I would be hesitant on new car purchase until they've worked out the kinks.
As for software updates extended warranty has saved my butt many times with my Dell XPS. Weekly software updates and they've replaced the laptop several times all under extended warranty
 
owns 2006 Lotus Elise
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#24 ·
Assuming there is no warranty is the right outlook to have with a lotus.

My dealer, 3 hours away, told me I would need to drop my car off (for an undetermined amount of time) and then they could reach out to lotus for approval of warranty work for parts that they know are not in stock and will take at least a few weeks. How do you expect to compete with any of the competition?
 
#27 ·
Can someone explain to me the rationale behind the I4? Less performance, increased cost. Much modification to fit. And the worst part, when a bystander asks what engine is in your beautiful car, you have to sheepishly say, Oh it's a 4 banger.
Having had an Esprit S4s for 18 years, everyone loved the looks but was underwhelmed when I answered, "Well it's a turbo 4".
So tell me why this variant exists.
 
#28 ·
Can someone explain to me the rationale behind the I4? Less performance, increased cost.
So tell me why this variant exists.
One word: China. Geely intends to make Lotus their Chinese market luxury sport brand and the V6 was never going to meet regulations there. Selling it in other markets is more just about opportunity after developing the car.
 
#32 ·
If the Chinese market (that is only getting the i4) is getting a 400bhp tuned variant, I do agree that they are short chaining everyone else. The choice should really be between a V6/Manual and a i4/DCT.

Watching some of these other videos you can clearly see 500-1000rpm lags in gear shifts and the visible lag in the display/revs its kind of crazy they would release this to any reviewer or customer. Hell I think the IPS shifts up and down faster than what I am seeing in these videos.
The V6 IS definitely being sold to China. I was at the Hethel factory two months ago and witnessed quite a few (nearly all yellow!) "Lotus Nyo" (the branding Lotus is forced to use in China) Emiras being readied for export to China.
 
#33 ·
Can someone explain to me the rationale behind the I4? Less performance, increased cost. Much modification to fit. And the worst part, when a bystander asks what engine is in your beautiful car, you have to sheepishly say, Oh it's a 4 banger.
Having had an Esprit S4s for 18 years, everyone loved the looks but was underwhelmed when I answered, "Well it's a turbo 4".
So tell me why this variant exists.
Others have missed the key reason, and that is emissions. Harry mentioned the difference at the beginning of the video. It impacts road tax in the UK, and the ability to pass upcoming EU7 regs. The V6 is a dinosaur and being phased out by Toyota. Lotus/Geely needed a new drivetrain to move the Emira forward. Taxes in China (and other countries) were no doubt a factor in the decision on engine size. The AMG drivetrain is modern, the brand has cache, it has headroom for significantly more power, less weight, and Geely owns part of MBAG. Ticks all of the boxes. No-brainer, really.
 
#38 ·
LOL Now you see the value of the Lotus V6 the Ford GT and NSX has a V6 The Ferrari has one but it is a Hybrid like NSX. Emira 360 HP is strong for 4 cyl great value
Look at the BMW Supra yuck is not Exotic and I worked 25 years as a Service Manager at Toyota dealers its a Toyota mistake for $$$
 
#41 ·
As an owner of a 2021 AMG GLA 45 (Although has 400hp in the I4) which has pretty the same engine and transmission, I'd stay away from that combination in the Lotus. The shifting is really terrible in auto mode. It really doesn't know what gear to be in, or stays in the wrong gear for too long. You have to really put your foot down for a few seconds before anything happens engine-wise also. It does take off quite well once the turbos kick in, but you have to wait for it.
 
#51 ·
Your candor is greatly appreciated!!!
This would be like me loving everything about my 2015 2dr Evoque Dynamic EXCEPT the lousy tranny it had. Thde dreaded ZF 9 speed.